Is "gelf" still a thing?

[Thrumdi]

I played Regnum Online about 3 years ago (mid-2010). At that time, the phrase "gelf" was widespread to describe players from the realm Syrtis. It was generally understood that this meant "gay elves".

Regnum recently appeared on Steam, and a few of my guild members expressed some interest in trying out the game. (We are primarily a PvP guild currently playing Guild Wars 2). However, we do have an explicit non-discrimination policy, as we have gay members, and guidies who have gay family members.

Before I can recommend our guild try out Regnum, I need to do due diligence about terms like this. Is "gelf" still widely used in chat, on the forums and elsewhere?

[PT_DaAr_PT]

Yes, but I can't understand why it has to be such a big deal. Syrtis looks gay and has elves, so somebody decided to call players of that realm gelf. I have never seen the word gelf being directed at a gay person that plays that realm. The majority of people don't really think much about the g in gelf. And to be honest, I don't give a shit and not even the most famous gelf of Regnum had a problem with it, and he is gay. You can read his own words:

So shall we make a poll among gay people what language can we use?
How ridiculous can it get?
I am gay too. As far as I am concerned, I don't CARE. ITS MY OWN PERSONAL BUSINESS. I know what language there is around world and I don't give a holy crap about it. I don't give a fuck if people tell jokes about polish people, either! I LAUGH cause they're FUNNY.
What the hell, man? There are gay people who unfortunately worked their asses hard on the status people pin to us now. Feminine looks, faggots, fashion sense, rainbows and teapot pose. THERE WILL ALWAYS BE LIKE THAT so why bother? Syrtis DOES look gay, but in all possible meanings. Looks happy, looks feminine, looks queer, looks lame. I admit, I HATE the gay chicken that's our mount :P

What we do in our bedrooms is our personal matter and saying GAY ELVES in a MMO game doesn't touch our sex life, does it?

What, are gay people the only ones that can use "gay" word? Mass hysteria and political correction is what I hate the most. And that's why I am ashamed of being gay, cause if I tell that to people, they always see me like a typical queer. I can't help it tho, I can only shrug and say I DONT CARE.


So, to sum it up, a drama queen who's crying to stop using phrase gelf, try to imagine it's green elf. Now, better?


DISTANCE.

[Hopeakettu]

It is, indeed. However, I think the 'gay elf' interpretation is problematic in my opinion. I've always preferred to primarily decode it as 'green elf', which is probably the original meaning.

(Then again, there was a time in the past when being 'gay' had nothing to do with sexual orientation.)

OT: I wonder if people interpret 'goats' as 'gay oats' :huh:

EDIT: +1 to the post above

[VeterKh]

i really don't care about sexual orientation of Realm Sirtis. It's a GAME.

[Quincebo]

Like all alsius players are goats in real life, or have goats in their backyard

Like all ignis players are pigs, or have pigs in their backyard

[Wield_II]

http://i.imgur.com/FVV9z.gif

[_Kharbon_]

Basically, I agree with Daar and Hopeakettu.

The term "gelfs" is still generally used, but I doubt, that many players still know what it originally meant.
Personally, I always understood it as a abbreviation from the word "goat". Since Alsirians are generally known as "goats" (for rather obvious reasons), I thought, that the "g" from the beginning of the word was stocked upon the word "elf", to create a "gelfs" :D (I hope, this makes a bit of sense :P)

When I learned what "gelf" ment, I started using my (c) modification "gelfie", and for goats "goatie" :P. Still, the simple word gelf and goat is much more convenient to use, than any other, to distinguish between the two realms in war.

Therefore, I wouldn't consider this term much more discriminating than "pig", that's used to call ignis :P

[Checkit]

Just don't play. We don't need a group of people who are going to get offended by every little thing said to them.

Also, +123219083092185012930281942 to the quote in Daar's post.

[Hollow-Ichigo]

Syrtis players are known as gelfs, get over it :P

[GrimNightfall]

I'm a gelf, and proud. Even though a good half of Syrtis hates me :D

[Rising_Cold]

I dunno.. but I proudly call myself a smelling-long-hairy-beast-with-no-good-looks-at-all
its funny and defenitly never meant to offend people
same goes with 'gelfs'

besides.. we got gay goats too, not sexually, just another word for annoying the hell out of me

[_Kharbon_]

Just on a quick sidenote,
Does the term "goats" mean "Gay Oats"? :O




:P

[standistortion]

Just on a quick sidenote,
Does the term "goats" mean "Gay Oats"? :O




:P
You can make beer from oats soooo.... happy beer? Sounds good to me :)

@OP, your concerned "gay elves" might hurt your friends feelings? If they're that sensitive then their gentle feelings could be damaged when the big, hunky barbs come to slit their throats from ear to ear and rip out their still beating hearts.

[Hollow-Ichigo]

I'm a gelf, and proud. Even though a good half of Syrtis hates me :D

I love you <3

[GrimNightfall]

I love you <3
Love you too bb<33

[JainFarstrider]

I'm fine with gay people. But why are there people who jump out at anything that might possibly (but improbably) be a negative connotation to them? Most of the internet community is already speaking loudly for homosexuality, it's not like they have to prove themselves or anything. As many people advocate (and what Piz says) - it's your own personal business.

[Thrumdi]

Thanks for the replies.

We are going to pass on this game then. As it looks like nothing has changed since 2010.

[Aries202]

You shouldn't be playing or using the internet then, your gay members sound more dramatic than woman. :facepalm3:

Goodluck where ever your guild stays at, hopefully in a game where "gay" isn't used. :lol:

[Shwish]

Hello Kitty Island is a better option?

If it makes you feel any better, I love the Syrtis chicken. I would really like to have my very own Chocobo but unfortunately I'm a gay oat.

[ieti]

I think most of the internet people are pretty tolerant. I really really doubt anyone here have anything against gay people. We live in a free world and we seek our place where we feel calm and happy. People are different and different things make them happy.

I think goats, gelfs and pigs are used in a joking way. After all this is a war game and even grownups seek here a place to return to their childhood and play a little war without hurting someone.

Well things can get little steamy when we fight, but after it all is alright.

So whatever you choose - play here or move on. Well be happy and have fun. :thumb_up:

[time-to-die]

I think goats, gelfs and pigs are used in a joking way.

ofcourse it is :D

[m4cgregor]

It's seems to be an english speakers community issue.

In Ra doesn't exist.

By the fact, in Syrtis exist the Alturian ( no elf ) race.

And the Lamais ( in all the realms ).. are really gayfriendly

[Kellindil82]

I really don't get it why there isn't a topic like this for the hetero, lesbian, travy, and ofc for animal lover ppl! They should complain about goats and pigs! This topic is bullshit! Sexual identity is your own business! Don't force other ppl into your intim world!

[bois]

For a thread like this to get any traction it must really be a slow week on this forum .:o

It's a game. This is a non issue. Move on .

[Hayir]

wtf is wrong with you guys.

Gay people never ever laugh about jokes concerning other minorities.
It is not like they get only loud once they are affected themselves. They are no hypocrites!


"Every minority has the right to be discriminated"

[ieti]

Alot people have some issues with something. I got a problem with talking freely - i stammer alot. This gives me alot problems sometimes. I can not be trader and can not talk in front of alot people i can not talk on telephone - even ordering in restaurant is sometimes a pain. Well who cares - i'm a happy person and i live with that. It is not a problem until you make it a problem for yourself.

My mother teached me something - do not disturb people, be nice, respect them. Then all will be alright.

I do not judge people by skin color, by sexual orientation, religion and stuff. I try to teach my daughter the same. Alot people are tolerant and nice.

Peace and have fun. :drinks:

[Shwish]

I don't know why people are still arguing about this. We already scared the OP and his clan away.

[Mehran]

in the golden days we use to call pigs, tomatoes. :huh:

[Krungle]

in the golden days we use to call pigs, tomatoes. :huh:

I had no clue former VPs of the USA played this game.

Anyway, Gelf stands for Green Elves, but everyone know elves are a happy people and since gay=happy that works, too.

[Mehran]

I had no clue former VPs of the USA played this game.

Anyway, Gelf stands for Green Elves, but everyone know elves are a happy people and since gay=happy that works, too.

well.. not to brag but ice cube use to call me general for a reason...:tsk_tsk:

[Yttrium]

You've all sadly missed the point and we've lost new players because of it.

Allowing the use of the word gay as a snyonym for 'undesirable quality' will make many gay people feel unwelcome. Even if you don't mean it that way, how is a gay person supposed to know that? Since many gay people are beaten, abused and shunned for being the way they are, it is logical for them to assume that people who use gay in a derogatory sense hate them.

Instead of gay, imagine this same argument about the n-word in america. Should black americans just 'toughen up' and assume that when white people use this word they are using it in a nice way and don't actually want to lynch them?

[bois]

I still feel that this matter is blown out of proportion. And I don't think I missed the point. This game is reasonably mature and has a crowd to suit.

I have seen faaaar worse in almost every other MMORPG I have ever played and in a much more corrosive fashion. Does this mean that everyone who is "gay" stop playing MMORPGS? I doubt.
I feel that anyone who is comfortable in being homosexual and actually watches the chats in this game would realise that any assertion here is almost in a fun loving way and excludes any kind of violence for the most part. In fact any kind of subversive tone is covered in the Terms of service and is dealt with if reported.

The issue of Gelfs meaning "gay elves" and anyone being seriously affected by this is a hypersensitive person and may find life very difficult in any MMORPG. Regnum Online is tame compared to many others.

On a side note of the n word. I have noticed that people of African descent use that word far more than white people actually use it. And, they use it on each other . Go figure. In my home country and my specific island which is 90% black, the term is thrown about regularly. You almost never hear a white person utter it. Perspective Perspective ... tsk tsk.

TL;DR : A non issue. Get over it.

[GrimNightfall]

They weren't going to get far anways. In another thread he said they would play Regnum only during "off-nights". I wouldn't be able to see them getting any further than lvl 30.

Also this is the internet. If you get depressed when somebody calls you gay, leave.

[Pnarpa]

Actually, you're all wrong. Gay elves means everyone in Syrtis is happy, merry.

[Tamui]

Actually, you're all wrong. Gay elves means everyone in Syrtis is happy, merry.

Except you. You're just plain mean and grumpy! :(

OT: +1 to Grim and bois

[Carn]

They call us gelf, we call them pigs and goats.
I don't see a problem.

Because I'm an Alturian.

[Checkit]

Instead of gay, imagine this same argument about the n-word in america. Should black americans just 'toughen up' and assume that when white people use this word they are using it in a nice way and don't actually want to lynch them?

Gay = black/african-american
Faggot = nigger

The first two are not inherently demeaning; you have to make them so.
The second two are inherently demeaning.

Your analogy sucks anyway. Black people should just "toughen up". Racism will continue to exist when you don't let go of the past.

[SanguineLamai]

They call us gelf, we call them pigs and goats.
I don't see a problem.

Because I'm an Alturian.

Yes because its got to be better to be called a gelf, that have anyone call us ignis pigs.

Gelf seems infinitely less derogatory than Pig.

Im a lamai. Im not a pig.

[GrimNightfall]

Yes because its got to be better to be called a gelf, that have anyone call us ignis pigs.

Gelf seems infinitely less derogatory than Pig.

Im a lamai. Im not a pig.

Silence, pig! :D

[SanguineLamai]

Silence, pig! :D

But....but....but....Im not a pig.

My ears are too big, I dont have a stout nose, and I hate playing in the mud.

Really.

[standistortion]

Never minded either being a goat or calling someone a gelf but pig always seems a bit to much, this (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CEYQtwIwAg&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DpZC yOWLrRTE&ei=Dj9CUd-xG-qw7AaWvYGoDA&usg=AFQjCNEvzHo0_ZLL4Gt4_IoMnP6p9BvdEQ&sig2=KE_Q78DrcgenLaGmZ2ECCw&bvm=bv.43287494,d.ZGU&cad=rja) gives it another angle though.

[SanguineLamai]

Never minded either being a goat or calling someone a gelf but pig always seems a bit to much, this (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CEYQtwIwAg&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DpZC yOWLrRTE&ei=Dj9CUd-xG-qw7AaWvYGoDA&usg=AFQjCNEvzHo0_ZLL4Gt4_IoMnP6p9BvdEQ&sig2=KE_Q78DrcgenLaGmZ2ECCw&bvm=bv.43287494,d.ZGU&cad=rja) gives it another angle though.

Evil minds that plot destruction.

Sorcerer at deaths construction......

OH LORD D'YEAH!!!!!!

Sacred Reich did a better version of it IMHO. Creds to Ozzy though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbhxySwAXa0

[standistortion]

Not bad but just not the same to sing along to :) Thought Motorhead also covered War Pigs but cant find it, Hayseed Dixie's (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3peH3ppJKxo) version's fun though :) Hard to hear that and not think of this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXhUNUqmF0s) and the pig reference that brings to mind gets things nicely back on topic :)

[Rising_Cold]

Im a lamai. Im not a pig.

lamai? whats lamai? Ive only seen rats, rats and goats, rats and gelfs, rats and pigs
^^

[Imago-Thunderfist]

lamai? whats lamai? Ive only seen rats, rats and goats, rats and gelfs, rats and pigs
^^

Hentai Gremlins* :p

No-one likes 'em ^^

[ieti]

But...but...but... :ohill: Gremlins???

I can clearly say 99.99% of CoR population are lemmings!!!

Anyway lama's are cool, lama's are furry, lama's are nice. We own! Well we need to be little more better looking. And human clothes look eww on us.

Go, go lama powa! :D

[Hopeakettu]

http://www.bezeckaskola.cz/files/thumbnail/3730-2D0-lama-jsem-a-lama-zustanu_HWx600x800.jpg


But...but...but... :ohill: Gremlins???

I can clearly say 99.99% of CoR population are lemmings!!!

Anyway Dwarves are cool, Dwarves are furry, Dwarves are nice. We own! Well we don't need to be better looking. And human clothes look eww on humans.

Go, go Dwarf powa! :D

Fixed that for you :drinks:

[Tamui]

I hate lamais. They have freakish eyes and they are too small! They're ugly!



To furry lovers; I love furry things like a dog or a kitten(not a cat). But! Not. Lamais.

[Awrath]

I hate lamais. They have freakish eyes and they are too small! They're ugly!



To furry lovers; I love furry things like a dog or a kitten(not a cat). But! Not. Lamais.

Me too. Join me one day, I go hunting Lamais every Thursday on Mimic.

[Tamui]

Me too. Join me one day, I go hunting Lamais every Thursday on Mimic.

I'd gladly join you :D

[Vadhir]

I have used the word Gelf a lot of times, never asked why english speakers used that word instead of Elf... And today, I have discovered its meaning... I feel so wise (?)

[Lucky_Luke]

Me too. Join me one day, I go hunting Lamais every Thursday on Mimic.

Lately you are being very distractive... ;-)

[Awrath]

Lately you are being very distractive... ;-)
:p Just doing my job, trying to take the heat off our mages!

[rogueish]

Wow in all my years of playing I never knew "gelf" officially meant "gay elf" lol.
I always assumed it was green elf or a reference to the lame "gelfs" Muppet characters from the Dark Chrystal movie.
Live and learn lol.

[Rising_Cold]

Wow in all my years of playing I never knew "gelf" officially meant "gay elf" lol.
I always assumed it was green elf or a reference to the lame "gelfs" Muppet characters from the Dark Chrystal movie.
Live and learn lol.

I think those two are actually more accurate than gay elf.. but most people prefer rude explenations
and stick to those.

[ieti]

For me this names we call enemies are a little bit "war taunts". You get into the war, you get adrenaline and stuff and you really need sometimes to express more direct in some cases. See "Brave Hart" for example how they taunted the enemy before battles. We need emotes like that in fact. :rolleyes2:

In the other side i have been in 2 realms and i never seen problems with people that are different in some way. People are friendly and nice. Well this is internet and there are some retards of course.

Even with war and the heat around it people are nice when on Christmas central island is open and you can talk to players from enemy realms.

[Takeyo]

It is, indeed. However, I think the 'gay elf' interpretation is problematic in my opinion. I've always preferred to primarily decode it as 'green elf', which is probably the original meaning.

(Then again, there was a time in the past when being 'gay' had nothing to do with sexual orientation.)

OT: I wonder if people interpret 'goats' as 'gay oats' :huh:



This! Why are people so eager to interpret things in a derogatory manner?! I have always read it as "green elves" (meaning forest elves and referring to them in terms of the colour of their realm, indicating the realms people in general by extension) as opposed to the Ignis whose elves are dark elves which I would describe as purple or red for similar reasons. What we're doing is simply indicating what other realm is involved, not casting a slur on any realm! Half the time I simply report colours. Referring to Syrtis as "green" and Alsius as "blue" with no nicknames attached. Maybe we should just use colours since they're just as easy to type and nobody will misinterpret them... on second thought maybe they will :dumbofme:
Still, fyi here is a Drow who loves the old country! I joined Ignis because they're somewhat of the underdog on my server, and I decided I just HAD to have a dark elf... but the Forest always calls to my elven blood... :hat: Keep being awesome and elven you awesome Syrtians you! :punk:

[Takeyo]

And now that I read the thread I see that a lot of people feel like I do about the term... why must haters hate? IT STANDS FOR "GREEN ELF" apparently all real people realize this! Glad to see I don't stand alone... or with just one other :P

[errei]

hi im a gelf

[Shwish]

hi im a gelf

I would like a little gelf inside me too

[Takeyo]

I would like a little gelf inside me too

gelf at heart! ;)

[DMAN]

I hate lamais. They have freakish eyes and they are too small! They're ugly!



To furry lovers; I love furry things like a dog or a kitten(not a cat). But! Not. Lamais.


You like goats?

[Wi3ld]

You like goats?

Goats are terrible. Often Satan/Lucifer/Beelzebub is depicted as a half man, half goat. Is this a coincidence? I think not. Also, I was chased through a housing estate by a rogue goat when I was younger, and the fear of these horrid creatures with horns has stuck with me ever since.

[xayne]

Yes, "gelfs" is still a thing. Every time they port away from a fight after losing a few people I am reminded of why the term gay elves is still fitting.

[Rising_Cold]

Yes, "gelfs" is still a thing. Every time they port away from a fight after losing a few people I am reminded of why the term gay elves is still fitting.

green elves*

that they port away from fights, denying rps.. killcounts and the satisfaction of winning
is totally a player thing.. even tho 99.59% of syrtis does it
we should find a gay friendly hatename for them :p

[Hollow-Ichigo]

If I had a Mage WM I'd port the fuck out of every fort I could, don't hate the players, hate da game

[Lebeau]

If I had a Mage WM I'd port the fuck out of every fort I could, don't hate the players, hate da gameNo...

...wrong, Ichi-kins...

...fookin'-bully-craven-skanky-squirrel-molestin'-cat-piss-drinkin'-zergling-gelftard-pussywimps...

..."hate the players" ... AND ... "hate da game".

Also while we're at it, let's nerf WM teleports. As is, they are routinely being abused for tactical escape. They should ONLY be allowed to be used strategically, NEVER tactically. So, the nerf would be to increase their casting time & to make it so they can NEVER be cast while INside of a fortification...GET 'ER DONE ALREADY, NGD!

:p

[schachteana]

Also while we're at it, let's nerf WM teleports. As is, they are routinely being abused for tactical escape. They should ONLY be allowed to be used strategically, NEVER tactically. So, the nerf would be to increase their casting time & to make it so they can NEVER be cast while INside of a fortification...
yes indeed.

I also think that it should be impossible to leave the fort once the fort gate has been opened,
and it should be impossible to capture the fort's flag without the guards being dead.
A barbarian guard would be more appropriate for defending the flag, too, I think

[Lebeau]

...it should be impossible to leave the fort once the fort gate has been opened...That's one way to handle the annoying misuse of trapdoors ... but a better way, imho, is to have the trapdoor UNlock once the fort's gate gets broken ... which is to say, ANYone can then use it. If one wants to escape cleanly, that's alright, but they'll have to bust a move & leave earlier than when fort gate gets broken.

My way, once gate breaks & enemies try to run away to evade pursuers using the trapdoor, u can follow if u like, & don't have to run around to main door or jump over wall only to see them run back in again or get away due to the delay caused by detouring &/or slowed-movement injury (the current paradigm is entirely like some legal/accepted sort of 'exploit', same as the tactical use of wm-banners to escape a falling fort; both are totally pussified bs).

Routs rightly SHOULD be bloody, ugly things to those defeated, but instead, the current mechanics are this can't-catch-us, go-fuck-yo'self, unfair one-sided escape-hatch &/or insta-relocation to safety that allows, nay rewards, complete cowardice & those losers who won't fight once the battle is fair & they lack tall walls to huddle & hide behind. PLEASE NGD, END THIS:warning:

[halvdan]

...
...
I wonder why so many people complain about wm tele from besieged fort. Can't get rid off feeling it's just crying cos your rps are teleing too. Rps whoring event is over, why then?
If enemies tele out, they loose fort anyway. Not giving their realm points won't change anything in your victory, really.

'Misusing' trap door is another chapter i think. Isn't the same as tele, cos it gives advantage to defenders in battle. Tele won't give you more kills or fun, repetitive use of trap can be pretty annoying.

[The_Pirate]

We got this all wrong.

I think gelfs should have Tele taken away from them permanently.

Much better - tele should dump them right outside wherever the largest gathering of goats/pigs is. This should ofc also come with an automatic system verification that the gelfs will be outnumbered.

Gelfs should at the point of materialising in front of the goat/pig zerg, also have an automatic no-cast period, kind of like when you dismount, but ofc be able to get attacked. Oh, and 10 necro points for all the materialising gelfs.

Since it is not fair that only one of the other two realms would get to hammer the gelf group, perhaps once they all die they should then be teleported to right in front of the other realm's larger group.

NGD should also make it such that once the goat & pig's largest groups get their go, the gelf group is split up into smaller groups and automatically teleported to the many other goat & pigs group in their respective realms.

Oh and at moment of gelf materialisation, goat & pig groups should automatically be WM bannered, without anyone having to cast banner.

Pls NGD fix this! It is completely unacceptable that this does not happen :( You are so clearly gelf biased. They deserve much worse than this, but us goats & pigs are very nice people and we will only request this one minor balance update and ignore all the other potential fixes which will create a fairer play experience for us goats and pigs. For now...

Jarne/Jaro Seeker - a goat & pig 'sleeper' agent in a poor gelf's body

[schachteana]

I wonder why so many people complain about wm tele from besieged fort. Can't get rid off feeling it's just crying cos your rps are teleing too. Rps whoring event is over, why then?
If enemies tele out, they loose fort anyway. Not giving their realm points won't change anything in your victory, really.

'Misusing' trap door is another chapter i think. Isn't the same as tele, cos it gives advantage to defenders in battle. Tele won't give you more kills or fun, repetitive use of trap can be pretty annoying.

After hours of fighting, most of all players will want to get some reward. No matter if rlm points are important, it is what quite a lot see as their motivation.
Plus, everyone seeks for revenge after having been penetrated at their very own fort.
Being able to kill your enemy is a inevitable requirement for a mmorpg like Regnum. You may not be affected by players escaping the fort and running away by using ports and trap doors, but the majority of us is.

I have no idea what this thread is about actually but anyway

[Takeyo]

Wow, everyone hates Syrtis so much :P Personally, I only hate Alsius. What should really happen is that losing the fort by porting away turns out to be disadvantageous because the opposing force then gains momentum and you begin to lose territory fast. They don't need to disable ports inside castles and forts, just work on the balance so that it's not such a good idea. The trapdoors need one of two changes: either the exit should be placed in range of the wall, or they should become unlocked for all players once the fort gate is down. One of the two would be plenty to solve the problem. Right now the exits are underneath the range of the wall so it's hard for anyone to guard them from the top.
Now back on topic. Gelf is a real word. I don't know if anyone realizes that, but it's true. According to some sources, http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=11&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CF4QFjAK&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.urbandictionary.com%2Fdefine. php%3Fterm%3Dgelf&ei=AcfDU9LUCMXy8QGck4GIBQ&usg=AFQjCNHVx1LS9VuFmpCdgbQEDXC08-L7Zg&sig2=Nqi9JEOCTYQ_laWZSEuKCQ&bvm=bv.70810081,d.b2U
There is no reason whatsoever to assume that it stands for something particularly coarse, or insensitive for that matter. However, I have never been able to figure out why we don't just call the realms by their names, or their abbreviations, or even their colours. That's just me I guess ;)