Marksman damage

linearguild · 04-13-2010, 05:11 PM

I don't get the logic of people complaining "marksmen don't do enough damage" and then dismissing spells that give +20% ranged damage or +15% hit chance and +25% attack speed as useless. Barbs have to buff a LOT to reach their full potential for damage. Why do players seem to expect that marksmen should have always-on high-damage autohits for free?

Mattdoesrock · 04-13-2010, 05:33 PM

I still cry myself to sleep at night over the combat nerf - yes nerf, and the DS nerf for Marks (/Archers) but I generally agree with you.

With some decent gear marks can still hit pretty nicely, and alot don't take advantage of all the spells at their disposal, like you said.

However, it's true that Barb's do need to buff up alot to reach their full potential, but a Barb's full potential is far more devastating than a Mark's full potential. But this is only true if both sides have "average" gear. A Marks with imba gear is far more improved over a Barb with imba gear; compare a before and after with Enio vs. Bulgaro for example.

_Enio_ · 04-13-2010, 05:36 PM

1. DS is barely a dmg increase 1 vs 1. Also its not a selfbuff. Check threads about DS for why its not much used atm.

2. +hitchance is not a dmg increase in that sense.

3. You forgot to mention Maneuver, Pointshot

4. Hawks gaze is a 25% dps increase for 30s in a 180s CD on 5

Marks isnt in a good shape atm. Range is flawed, Damage is flawed, Mana budget is flawed.

Take a normal equipped marks for balance and then tone down High end equip/mechanics. THats the way to go and then youll really see the flaws.

Regards.

Vroek · 04-13-2010, 06:18 PM

They took 42 dmg(with 90 dex) away and removed ~1.2 sec invocation from a slow bow.

They add a delay for normal hit when a ranged class move, rather insignificant since spells work the same.

The love NGD show for their ranged classes is a beautiful thing.

_Enio_ · 04-13-2010, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vroek

They took 42 dmg(with 90 dex) away and removed ~1.2 sec invocation from a slow bow.

They add a delay for normal hit when a ranged class move, rather insignificant since spells work the same.

The love NGD show for their ranged classes is a beautiful thing.

Sorry but, LOL.

Play a storebought 1350 mana marksman and compare it to other classes out of the shop. Then come back and say that again..

Mellion · 04-13-2010, 09:30 PM

I know why I stopped playing marks completely.

DINK22 · 04-13-2010, 10:09 PM

The reason we need to deal high damage is because if not then we are weaker versions of hunters..so why pick a marksman then. we cant really cc better than hunters, we cant camo, or support other players as well. what unique role do marksmen play if it cant be high-damager?
and it costs points and mana to do the damage we do or else we hit with no real threat.

Minorian · 04-13-2010, 11:19 PM

God, I hate the people that say "you have RA, your damage is kickass, so stop complaining." For their information, a pet is like damage bonus +120%. I know it doesnt have a range, but these days the trolltards are lightning fast and attack while moving. Now add that to camo, and passive speed.

WTF????? i dont see any way that marksmen and hunters are balanced. The only way my marksmen can do damage in battle is spells, and his spells do about as much dmg as my 25 barb >.> yes i know barb has no ranged, but the barb is using nrml hits, the marx is using spells. The only thing marksmen can do right now is tank weak ranged damage. But what use does the tanking ranged damage do when a lock can ivy you and kill you before you know what the fucks goin on.

Marks are terrible right now, they need either alot more mana, or a good dmg increase. Or just give meh steal pet ^^

DINK22 · 04-14-2010, 12:04 AM

and here's the shocker..real good hunter armor (i.e. excellent,or vg piercing) + defense buffs can cause a marks with lvl 4 charge to do only 40-80ish damage per hit to a hunter. so hunters are hitting me sometimes with more damage than i am to them, plus they have a pet that has a potential of doing 300+ damage per hit. Throw in a hunter using sudden strike and continuously running in circles around the marksman while the pet kills him in 5-6 hits. The marksman may be able to get about 4-5 hits out by the time hes dead. But for the sake of balance, marksmen don't need higher damage?

Topogigio_BR · 04-14-2010, 01:37 AM

The thing is marks has spells damage but they have long cast comparing the actual dynamic of game and that normaly marks dont have CS gems or spells.
Marks most deadly spells are base damage multipliers. You can see DS, Recharged, Lethal strike etc. and basicaly with the 1.08 version this base damage was reduced meaning a great nerf for marks.
You still see some marks doing great damage but this is because they have awsome gear.
Mostly marks do like 300-400 normals and it means it takes 3 to 4 shots just to break energy barrier spell from a support conju.
It also means that to kill a normal lvl50 knight with 4800hp, as some ppl told me, it will take 12 to16 shots.
This combined with the fact that you burn all your mana maybe even before to kill 1 single person is the reason while most marks are bleming.

04-13-2010, 05:11 PM	#1
linearguild Initiate Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Spawned at save Posts: 198	Marksman damage I don't get the logic of people complaining "marksmen don't do enough damage" and then dismissing spells that give +20% ranged damage or +15% hit chance and +25% attack speed as useless. Barbs have to buff a LOT to reach their full potential for damage. Why do players seem to expect that marksmen should have always-on high-damage autohits for free? __________________ Xia - Marksman · Saiph - Warlock · Amaron - Conjurer A proud member of I N Q U I S I T I O N

04-13-2010, 05:33 PM	#2
Mattdoesrock Count Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: England, UK. Posts: 1,055	I still cry myself to sleep at night over the combat nerf - yes nerf, and the DS nerf for Marks (/Archers) but I generally agree with you. With some decent gear marks can still hit pretty nicely, and alot don't take advantage of all the spells at their disposal, like you said. However, it's true that Barb's do need to buff up alot to reach their full potential, but a Barb's full potential is far more devastating than a Mark's full potential. But this is only true if both sides have "average" gear. A Marks with imba gear is far more improved over a Barb with imba gear; compare a before and after with Enio vs. Bulgaro for example. __________________ MattdoesJOKE_#40_NOT_FOUND RA / Hor... Haven?

04-13-2010, 05:36 PM	#3
_Enio_ Marquis Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany Posts: 1,843	1. DS is barely a dmg increase 1 vs 1. Also its not a selfbuff. Check threads about DS for why its not much used atm. 2. +hitchance is not a dmg increase in that sense. 3. You forgot to mention Maneuver, Pointshot 4. Hawks gaze is a 25% dps increase for 30s in a 180s CD on 5 Marks isnt in a good shape atm. Range is flawed, Damage is flawed, Mana budget is flawed. Take a normal equipped marks for balance and then tone down High end equip/mechanics. THats the way to go and then youll really see the flaws. Regards. __________________ Fix the Marksman subclass: Suggestion Last edited by _Enio_; 04-13-2010 at 05:57 PM.

04-13-2010, 06:18 PM	#4
Vroek Banned Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 890	They took 42 dmg(with 90 dex) away and removed ~1.2 sec invocation from a slow bow. They add a delay for normal hit when a ranged class move, rather insignificant since spells work the same. The love NGD show for their ranged classes is a beautiful thing.

04-13-2010, 09:30 PM	#6
Mellion Banned Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Germany Posts: 288	I know why I stopped playing marks completely.

04-13-2010, 10:09 PM	#7
DINK22 Pledge Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 5	The reason we need to deal high damage is because if not then we are weaker versions of hunters..so why pick a marksman then. we cant really cc better than hunters, we cant camo, or support other players as well. what unique role do marksmen play if it cant be high-damager? and it costs points and mana to do the damage we do or else we hit with no real threat.

04-13-2010, 11:19 PM	#8
Minorian Master Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Peterborough ON Posts: 597	God, I hate the people that say "you have RA, your damage is kickass, so stop complaining." For their information, a pet is like damage bonus +120%. I know it doesnt have a range, but these days the trolltards are lightning fast and attack while moving. Now add that to camo, and passive speed. WTF????? i dont see any way that marksmen and hunters are balanced. The only way my marksmen can do damage in battle is spells, and his spells do about as much dmg as my 25 barb >.> yes i know barb has no ranged, but the barb is using nrml hits, the marx is using spells. The only thing marksmen can do right now is tank weak ranged damage. But what use does the tanking ranged damage do when a lock can ivy you and kill you before you know what the fucks goin on. Marks are terrible right now, they need either alot more mana, or a good dmg increase. Or just give meh steal pet ^^

04-14-2010, 12:04 AM	#9
DINK22 Pledge Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 5	and here's the shocker..real good hunter armor (i.e. excellent,or vg piercing) + defense buffs can cause a marks with lvl 4 charge to do only 40-80ish damage per hit to a hunter. so hunters are hitting me sometimes with more damage than i am to them, plus they have a pet that has a potential of doing 300+ damage per hit. Throw in a hunter using sudden strike and continuously running in circles around the marksman while the pet kills him in 5-6 hits. The marksman may be able to get about 4-5 hits out by the time hes dead. But for the sake of balance, marksmen don't need higher damage?

04-14-2010, 01:37 AM	#10
Topogigio_BR Baron Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Brazil Posts: 622	The thing is marks has spells damage but they have long cast comparing the actual dynamic of game and that normaly marks dont have CS gems or spells. Marks most deadly spells are base damage multipliers. You can see DS, Recharged, Lethal strike etc. and basicaly with the 1.08 version this base damage was reduced meaning a great nerf for marks. You still see some marks doing great damage but this is because they have awsome gear. Mostly marks do like 300-400 normals and it means it takes 3 to 4 shots just to break energy barrier spell from a support conju. It also means that to kill a normal lvl50 knight with 4800hp, as some ppl told me, it will take 12 to16 shots. This combined with the fact that you burn all your mana maybe even before to kill 1 single person is the reason while most marks are bleming.