Things that need to change in Ignis...
 

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All of the english speaking players that refuse to start from lvl 1 again on horus should come together and form one super power..... Pass knowledge and tactics. Become the unstoppable force......:swordfight:

My guild is only for hunters, and will always be only for hunters... If you want to learn my tactics all are welcome...

Lol. Another guy who teach others how to play.
I dont think you're so expierenced as conj because you lost too much important points in your post.
So, if you think you alone know how to play this game - you mistakes. Anyway, I dont care.
Also I dont care about your guild. No idea if anyone cares.
useless thread, imho.

Good luck.

Erm dude..hate to tell you this..but DMC has been playing since game since Beta...so yeah he does know this game. After reading through his points about conjs...there are "some" crappy ones on Ra...as in they are selfish and then consequently they die because of this, ive seen it with my own eyes.

In the group I'm usually playing with on Horus this is basically how we play so... It does work.(unsure on the hunter setup though seems a bit... lacking? to me, haven't tried it though)

If you'd ever like to join us for a bit you're welcome to. Could always use more group oriented Hunters. ;)

If you aren't getting better, you're just getting worse. :swordfight:

oh yeah, it's rather obvious. :D

its not only just ignis..its syrtis too

we have some awful (as in crap) conjurors, not naming of course, but long story short, dont expect heals, and dont think theyre gonna rez you (you'll either be run over by said conjuror as he summons zarkit..and the time u may lay there if you choose, you could have gotten back to where you died)

dont get me wrong, not slamming all, and i DONT expect to get my ass saved if i do a boneheaded move, and healing and rezzing is a tireless job..i thank those i can when i can, but..if its your class, then play it like it should.

as a knight i often waste my mana i could protect myself with with auras because syrtis is stupid and falls for the terror rush alot. same with hp. im often left sitting and out of mana with minimal buffs for me, and if syrtis is pushed back..they will RUN and leave my ass to die quite nicely..a synergy would be nice..i never have asked for mana..but its common sense. most of these times i dont have a single enchantment on, while the other army does..

ive seen some awesome mages like frank n, tine, klel, etc etc, who always seem to buff and heal people..but..theyre the first to die it seems, cuz when syrtis runs, guess who is the slowest, and dont think for a second most will turn around to help slow someone killing you. i used to, with a kick, ambush, hinder/caltrops..guess what it got me killed. and for what? the conjurors or people who didnt give a damn about me anyways? thats why i just save myself now, unless i really do feel the need to be a hero (which aint likely nowdays) used to see the barbs run back and onsl the stragglers, never see it now.

no one gets theyre a team, thats my biggest complaint, along with conjurors in syrtis. like i said some are awesome and they make a huge difference, others need to seriously read or 'apprentice" under someone who knows how to play their class, for my hunter i was taught mostly by valorius (yeah i know people hated him and said he sucked but he taught me some nifty ideas i never thought of on my own) and for my knight...its trial and error setup, various chats with others..and studying my logs from other knights..as well as watching what some of our own do and when. so like the saying..

ive failed a thousand times..and thats why i succeed :)

as for your hunter advice i dont agree..

not about your setup, cuz i use basically the same and have for quite awhile, its only about the "my setup is better" part, oh i know that petless can pwn a pet hunter quite hard and retain his FULL dmg potential as long as he has mana while a pet hunter is crippled on loss of pet, and rarely has high dmg potential (compared to petless) its just choice is always good and thats whats great about hunter, being able to be a bit flexible..heck knows i cant kill crap using a pet setup, but i love petless, and others are vice versa. long as they get their primary role done sufficiently.


anyways..i just wish i could for once know what it feels like to be in a organized group, syrtis RA aint it.

Hi DemonMonger :smile:

I agree with all of your points, although I don't play the game anymore so I can't really say if the situation has changed much from last year. I do know that when I was playing regularly, all of these things were true, especially the issue with Conjurors not reviving, or reviving the wrong classes first, or worst using revive on less than LV5 in dangerous situations. It actually was less of a problem when I was playing in Ignis than when I played in Syrtis and Alsius, but the problem was still there nonetheless.

Personally, being one of the oldest Conjurors in the game (on Tari Rojyo and St Alia), and taught by other Conjurors such as Galynn and Valour, I have to say that the Conjurors of these times really do not know how to play their class at all. Back then, it was easy to have everyone in a party DI'ed, now they just blame it on the spell duration changes, like it is an excuse to not cast it. They don't realize the benefits they have compared to the past for example when Heal ally had a higher cooldown. I know gameplay as a Conjuror is hard... you must always be ready, but it can be done and if a person can't handle it they don't need to be playing that class.

I would however like to add that Conjurors need to learn how to use protection spells on allies who are rushing. Occasionally they throw out a DI, but that's not always enough. There are many other spells a Conjuror can use to help an ally advance, such as Material wall, Magic barrier, Regenerate ally (it lasts long enough for most rushes, so cast it ahead of them), and the new Friendly shielding which gives +50% armor, which is almost (+/- 5%) as good as any personal protection spell would be on LV5.

As for Hunters, pets are horrible right now no one should use them. Hunters who think pets are neccessary are just dillusional. With Dualshot on LV5 and the right setup you can do over 750 damage per attack (250 + 500) with piggybacking, and you can do the same kind of damage with Longbow if you use Ensnaring arrow and Dirty fighting. With Parabolic shot, you have 24 range when you use Dirty fighting with a range 30 bow, and you can make hits of over 1250 (500 + 750 ensnare) on mages with these weapons and spells. Repetition shot can hit over 1500 damage with Dirty fighting and even Projectile rain can do over 1300 damage on the primary target at range 20 (with Viper long bow, Dirty fighting and Parabolic shot). So Hunters need to learn, pets are NOT good at damage, the basic Hunter setup has alot more potential to do damage than some crappy pet, especially when it is always getting stuck, lost, killed and just generally being a liability.

All screenshots are made with a med/30 LV41 bow (Master long bow) with +24 fire damage.

Regards.

Some criticism:


shortbows #2 is missing. rapid shot is the best spell at all.
scouting #7, 9, 10: I don't need it. And camo lvl 3 is good enough.
evasion #7? Spell Elude works? :looking:
And everyone should use evasive tactics ;)
And why escapist 2? oO

crit of my hunter:

http://screenshot.xfire.com/screensh...c3cc82aa89.png

beat this :naughty:

And longbow + dirty fight is good, yes, but shortbow + rapid shot + dirty fight is far better. Same damage, more speed. (And dual shot)

Hi Seher,

You don't need passive speed? Why even bother playing a Hunter then?

It does work and doubles natural resistance, it is just not absolute anymore so enemy spell focus and Concentration can pass through it, so some enemies make it fail (like Marksmen).

So that you can keep it on you the entire fight with warriors and short-range archers. Also, when it's time to make an escape, just walk past a dead or alive enemy and... zooom.

Escapist can also be used to find invisible opponents.

And far less range. With such a configuration you will only be fighting at range 10-12.5 at most, which is barely more than Spiritual blow, which quite frankly isn't worth the added attack speed, especially since fast weapons (and Rapid shot) mess up piggyback timing. It's not just about making a big base hit, but following it up with a spell to do more damage in one animation, while also being careful with your mana usage to make maximum damage or evasion with it that makes the real difference. And Hunters don't have the same protections they had in the past, you must be more careful now. With my setup I can play either at range 20 (or less) or safely at range 39 while healing... it's your decision.

The way you play, you would likely exhaust your mana quite quickly without paying attention to how much you need to make an escape. This one I learned from DM himself, to watch your mana supply, and use it carefully. Think about each attack, and each move, and that's where the Hunter's true power will show through. The Hunter is a chessmaster, not a brawler.

Regards.

Mhh too lazy to level a marks, and being able to place the repshot perfectly is quite funny :)


I know that it works, at least theoretical. But I've never seen any difference...


It does all of that perfectly at lvl 1. It lasts 10 sec longer at lvl 2, yeah... It's not that important. (For me)



It depends on how youre playing. range 20 is almost useless for me, the important thing is that I can hit those inside the fort. Range 20, ok it's far more than my 7.5, but I can't use it. Either I'm close to the enemies, than I can use range 7.5 or I'm far away and I have to use 30+ (39).

Another point is that you can't use dual shot with the long bow... => 7 sec cooldown before I can use the next spell. And i prefer to fight at close-range :biggrin:


Mana doesn't matter while 2+ manacoms are near you, and without any mc near to me I wouldn't waste my mana like that.

Giving advice, like the conju advice you gave, is all well and good..

But tell hunters exactly what setup to use? Errr..

Just because it works for you, does not mean it'll work for everyone. Each persons setup is different and suits their playstyle.

And plus, if everyone had 19 shorts, I wouldn't recieve any lvl 5 shieldLOL's. :p

*pierce.

Did I read that right? DO NOT use pets past lvl 45? Why on earth not? Lvl 45 you might be able to get hyena at best and against only mages and unbuff'd archers are they decent. If you are going to be a hunter with a pet I'd suggest you choose speed or power for the pet.

There is another option to hunters that (In my opinion for RA - no so on Horus) works better then asssiting at a fort. Stop reinforcements at the bridges.

1) Get yourself and aother hunter or few (with pets) with stalker and go to bridge
2) Bring along with you a marks or two
3) Kill everyone that comes across the bridge

There is more than one way to assist in war then getting in the way at a fort...taking valuable conjurer time...and sitting quietly for 3 minutes until your rep cools down. Don't get me wrong...that is a good way to play at forts....but there are more ways.

We do not just sit idle waiting to attack when repetition cools down....
We are active on patrol and stalking in the enemy realm...
Hunter is by far the funnest class for me to play.. (tried them all)
Yes there are more ways to play a hunter. However, they are not as effective. Here is why...

1a)Long bow SP lvl 5 does less damage , drains more mana, has higher cooldown than Dual Shot.

1b)Long bow break apart is far weakers than shortbow tear apart. (these skills are used to bypass defence and do constant damage <great vs knights / conjis>)
Also when break apart lvl 5 ends the enemy gains + 200 health points, and when tear apart ends the enemy gains nothing. Tear apart > Break apart**

2)If you are using shortbow skill maxed to 19 with Dual Shot lvl 5 + composite dragon wing bow / viper bow, you can and should still carry a range 30 bow to hit those that try to escape with Ensnare (this will slow them down enough for you to Dual Shot combo + hinder) There is no escape. We can use range 39 also
Long bow skill + ensnare*

3)Pets in the place of a Dual Shot lvl 5 are only effective if
a) player stands still to fight you (tank)
b) player is ambushed
c) pet does not die
**Draw backs come on retreat or advancement, for the pet will slow you down or die from being out of range**

I will gladly give you the entire setup with all skill bars listed [f1] - [f4]

Being able to use the right skill at the right time is all that matters...

Pets are not even good when training for xp unless you are in a group with people that know how to not over damage the monster and allow all to obtain max grp bonus.

You can go petless and have infinate mana while training + using skills.

People all that I ask is that you explore other options and assist your realm.

I will see you in game... will you see me?:devil:

Solarus "I want to not only be effective in war, but also to all those that I come across in my realm" Versitile
Survival of the fittest...
Pet users are not Versitle... They are limited

DMC:

Share with me...and I will be more than happy to try - I'm always screwing around with configs anyway...

However, only one "petless" hunter has killed me since my return to RA and that was when I was afk taking a leak... Outside of that I've killed all I encountered with my pet.

I...like you...have learned to effectively fight - but using a pet. It's amazing what using mobility during a fight will do to your pet ability to attack. And when I'm buff'd lvl 5 dual shots do about 200 damage to me; however, my pet on wrath still deals 400+ damage to buff'd archers.

Having said that....I'm still willing to try new configs.

EDIT: Oh...if a petless hunter attacks my pet - I just use skin of the beast - I have PLENTY of mana

demon monger, you're clueless. please l2p before any further instructions on how to play.

<loads regnum> :naughty: ok
It's funny you say that. LMAO I love to test all possible options.

Pet's were better 13 months ago when they could run to range 55m and not die...

Perhaps NGD should make the pet teleport to the hunter when it is past range 30

Yea mobility does help your pet reach the enemy in battle, so does escapist :) .... 13 months ago pets had a skill to make them run faster.. hmm


If you use a pet.... you will have 1 of two problems...
1) you lack instant damage power
2) you lack the ability to escape from the enemy

Unless you are like 19 evasion 19 scouting 19 pets 11 long 11 tricks 6 short
but with this you lack the power to kill mass groups...

I feel it is better to put it all in one package..... and leave the baggage behind

Your request:swordfight:

items needed:
1) shortbow range 25 speed medium lvl 50
2) longbow range 30 speed slow lvl 50
3) shortbow speed fast

skills needed:
shortbow 19 skills #1 #7 #10 level 5
scouting 19 skills #2 #7 #8 #9 #10 lvl 5
evasion 19 skill #2 #5 #7 level 5
evasion 19 skill #9 level 2

skillbars
[f1]
[1] shortbow #1 / [2] scouting #2 / [3] shortbow #7 / [4] scouting #8
[5] scouting #10 / [6] tricks #1 / [7] evasion #10 / [8] evasion #2
[9] = item short bow weapon / [10] = item long bow weapon

[f2]
[1] tricks #3 / [2] tricks #2 / [3] shortbow #10 / [4] shortbow #9
[5] tricks #5 / [6] tricks #6 / [7] evasion #9 / [8] item arrows
[9] evasion #6 / [10] pets #1
** You can make any agro monster your pet in battle by using calm creature to lure it to you then low profile to release it on your enemy or friends.

[f3]
use f3 to hold your armors and rings for quick changes

[f4]
[1] evasion #7 / [2] evasion #3 / [3] evasion #5 / [4] evasion #1 /
[5] shortbow #5 / [6] shortbow #6 / [7] longbow #4 / [8] longbow #2
[9] item shortbow speed fast for quick buffing [10] item longbow range 30


enjoy Solarus!:devil:

Thanks to these posts several beta players don't even bother to stop by the forums anymore.

Players like DM, Vroek, Magnet, Blood, Zordak, Froste among many others (and my deep excuses for not referring them) play and actively test game features since the dawn of this game (or at least one of the "dawns" ^^).

So if you don't agree with them at least give proofs of your points of view, just like Solarus did, who himself is a very good hunter.

Personaly, as a hunter, I prefer a Molok Barbarian as a pet...

But this discussion is very old itself, Thanus inspired most of the petless hunters since Beta relying more on stealth and speed to overcome the opponent. Afterwards I remember Sanguenay, she used aggro (after reset system mind you) so effectively she didn't needed a pet!

Petless builds will have drawbacks though, mana management and 1st strike are imperative. Mastering the small details given by the game mechanism and knowing when to hide to seek later are a must regardless the points distribution. In fort wars is my favorite approach given the stealth factor, one can actually iddle among your enemies (provided you haven't painted yourself on a premium colour ^^)

Pet builds, or "true hunters" as some like to claim, are indeed powerfull too, however its major drawback is relying on... a pet. Granted, dmg output is almost mana free, however either the hunter is slower, or less defensive, because he WILL be less stealthy. The pet presents another issue, what happens when your opponent actually kills it first?

All in all it's not easy to play hunter, but when I balance the odds I prefer to claim the responsability to me when approaching an enemy, therefore I find it hard to play with a pet. Besides 3 "petless" rep shots can annihilate half of the "fort war tactics" currently used (tested!).

However, the "Alsius's Hunters" pet tactics has proven countless times to be a great threat to whomever crosses their path...

Shush noobchill, maybe you should try listening rather than aimlessly flaming. :ranting:

oh dear "ninjas" i hope for your good that the unbalanced camo (yeah unbalanced 90 secs of invisibility is way too much in an offensive or deffensive way) stays that way, otherwise you are gonna be so messed up.
i`ve never seen a configuration in any other subclass so based on a particular skill. its kinda sad u dont even use tricks ^^

This setup worked fine even when camo was 30 seconds duration.....
We will never be messed up WE EVOLVE...
So far all the changes have been in our favor :)

90 seconds is not unbalanced... Our camo has several drawbacks..
1) if we are hit while casting camo it is canceled... No other players get their skills canceled from a single basic hit or skill and need to wait for an extended amount of time.
2) in the past camos cooldown was alot less and duration was alot less.... also we could camo when being attacked and only a dizzy spell or knock would cancel us.

Using pets is good in the arena where you do not have the element of surprise or anywhere to run to. However, everyone knows the WZ is not like the arena.

He that knows not and knows that he knows not is wise...
He that knows not and knows not that he knows not is a fool..

<shrugs> What do you know?:bangin:

Thanus inspired me to become a hunter.... He was the terror of syritis....
With his hunter, he was there... you died... he was gone.... end of story.
Thanus never left footprints just a trail of bodies that he killed....

Alsius has always had great teamwork since beta....
They always had smaller numbers and still managed to own. Ignis has an average of the three in players and did well at times and poor at others... Syritis has always had a huge player mass, so in war they just rush and smash with few tactics.. (not saying all syritis lack tactics just being general)

I cream petless hunters on a daily basis. Go ahead, make my day.

I waste pet hunters on a minute by minute basis. Tell me where you want to meet :naughty:

Get a hunter on Horus :)

ah craps... no way.... I do not want to "re-level" on whore us.
It would have been nice if NGD allowed us to choose if we wanted our characters transferred over.

A shame, life for hunters is much better over there :p

Ok Ill think about it....

Me and my pet will be waiting :naughty:

i cant say that camo is balanced, and i know that the skill has trhowbacks, i preffer to say that it is an exagerated skill, its a huge advantage but is pretty hard to cast, ls not THAT hard either hunters escape using it all the time.
hiding behind a tree 4.5 secs and then dissapearing for 90 secs dont sound pretty balanced for me, or getting camo and and having 90 seconds to choose my victim, to position and to throw my 1k DMG skill dont seem to balanced either.
the actual camo is the reason why hunters have so many useless skill, any skill combined whit that would result unbalanced.
i know that many people is happy having this kind of easy playability (camo in, camo out) but sincerely, i dont enjoy it, it is pretty limited.

Ok Dani,

You do not like to be able to use camouflage.... the enemy can still kill you once you have camo'ed

1) chase the hunter and do not release [w] button
2) press a skill that you want to use on the hunter
3) once the hunter camos move to his location
4) let go of [w] and your skill will cast
** if everyone that is chasing the hunter does this... hes / she is dead instantly...

If you don't know now ya know:harhar:

<looks around to see how many hunter are about to backstab me for making this public>

Camo is best used to advance to the enemy and sneak attack.... it can be used to escape, but you need to have the perfect setup do be able to do it.

A knight can use challenge and cancel your camo.... come on now
A warrior can use mind squash and cancel your camo with the pre cast method... come on now...
A mage can use time master on your pet and you have a 75% chance to have your stalker surroundings cancel... come on now...
:swordfight: Mis Webos!

Hunters have a choice.. they are well rounded , balanced... Pet or Petless....
Scouting or Not.... Your build is your choice.... every choice has its strengths and weaknesses.

sorry but from my experience petless hunters were worth having only with old evasion.
now all those rare petless hunters on horus I see are worth only for cannon fodder.

hmm I do not rely on evasion..... I rely on speed and surprise.
Raptor style
My prey needs to worry about evasion :naughty:

With my pet I can still surprise people, like petless hunters :devil:

very true and 1vs1 its a slaughter if you do it......
Pets are great in some situations and from sneak attack 1vs1 its 97% win
But petless is balanced in all situations with the right setup.

It's ok Nightchill....
Playing a petless hunter is much like playing chess....
We all play that game differently...
Some start with pawns...
Some start with knights....
whats next?
In the end the result = checkmate for someone...

ok, i see that you dont see the point, im not wasting more time either yours or mine.
so, all i see is that camo is so unbalanced, that you think that its better play with an archer who can dissapear, than asking balance for the hunter, as long as you have camo, rep shot, and SoW you are gonna be happy having track monster, track ally, sentinel, and a whole spell tree useless (at least useless for u) that is kinda sad.
the "tactic" that u describe in your post is a bug. and i am already aware about that, and, if my memory serves me well, i think you would know.:wink:

hunters dont have choice, pet, or petles everyone needs 90 secs of camo, for doing something.

I don't think you understand.... I see the point, do you?

I use... track ally... I love it...
I use track monster... and I am lvl 50
I use sentinel.... its great!

Just because you do not use the skills does not mean that others also do not use the skills... How shallow...


Camo is not unbalanced.... rep shot has such a limited range that it is only effective when used from camo or against an enemy that is afk... (idiots that try to tank do not count). You and I both know that people that get in range of rep often run behind you or away from you within the 3 seconds it takes to cast repetition. If repetitions casting time remains 3 seconds, then camo is the best way to deploy it. If repetitions range remains 5 steps form player, then camo is the best way to deploy it.

Even the fact that we have 2 tracking skills is something that I use to make myself efficient. I keep ES on lvl 5 and TRE on lvl 1
ES range 400m 400 mana
TRE range 150m 100 mana
used in combination it's a great tool to hunt down prey...

I am sure now that you need to think hard before you claim someone does not see the point of the matters at hand.

Just so you know... track monster can also track enemies.... go test and learn
Just so you know... track ally can also track enemies... go test and learn...

each skill is like a tool in a tool box.. all are needed at certain times.

Just because you do not know to hit the nail with a hammer does not mean the hammer is useless... Why would you ask that we have all our hammers thrown away?:looking:

all by the easy way... sure, camo is the best way to surprise an enemy with rep shot or any other skill, nobody denies that! its like to say "sactuary is the best way to rezz a dead char" everybody can see it!

have you played hunter with 30 sec camo? you could go sneaky and deploy rep, just like you can doit now, with an slight difference, it was a challenge. mana was an important factor, a lot of practice was needed, a correct timing for enemies buffs to end, calculate distance and time to reach the enemy was important too, it was indispensable to stalk your enemies using the environment, rocks, trees, hills, even mobs like bears or tralls and then cast camo, because having 30 sec duration and 50% speed penalization you could cover a really small area walking invisible.

with the actual camo: you track some enemies, and go camo, sit for a while regain mana, and still have more than one minute to approach to your victims, you can see if they have an important buff, if they have, you can wait, almost all defensive buff lasts less than 90 sec. if they move a little u can chase them, and then u cast ure skill. it is like playing in "easy mode"

withe the old camo, escaping was not for sure, it was a matter of experience, and practice, and maybe a little luck.

with the actual camo, a hunter who cast it, is a hunter gone, all you have to do is run, run, run, then hide behind a tree for 4.5 secs and u are gone for 90 seconds, if u reappear, u reappear plenty of HP and mana.

i hope that your entire argument for camo not being unbalanced is not only that "it is the best way to deploy rep", i dont know about you, but i have deployed hundreds of repetitions shots using nothing but ambush(4)

regarding to the topic of the skills, is not only me, almost every hunter i know hates the fact of have a repeated passive skill, or a skill for tracking monsters ¿why on earth would i need that?
i dont care if track monster or track ally detects enemies too! i already got 2 more skills that does the same thing!

i dont need a toolbox replete of hammers, why, oh god why! i have 4 hammers?! please give me another tool!