Help please- Can anyone assist with weapon speed ratios?

[Seraphim19]

Hello all,
Forgive me if this question appears to be a bit mundane, but it highly affects my damage output strategy...

Does anyone know for certain the timing ratios for the differences in weapon speeds? In otherwords, how must faster does a FAST attack than a MEDIUM? Does this rate consist with the difference between MEDIUM and SLOW? For example, perhaps the FAST attacks 50% faster than a MEDIUM, and so the ratio would be 1:1.5... Does anyone know this number? If the speed ratios are 1:1.5 (from a speed to the next fastest speed) is really 50%, then damage per second, a medium bow could potentially be more powerful than a slow...

If anyone would be generous enough to share their knowledge on this, I would be much obliged

[Miraculix]

I would assume it is the same as the damage ratio, to even things out. Otherwise it would just render some weapon classes useless.

[ncvr]

Very Fast is 25% faster than fast, I think fast is 25% faster than medium, medium 25% faster than slow and slow 25% faster than very slow. That's just an estimate though.

[amade]

Using short spell cooldowns as a measuring stick I roughly worked out that fast is around 1.5-2 sec, med is 2.5, slow is 3.5. It seems like there's only one second difference between each level of speed.

[Miraculix]

Yes, slow must be 3.5 by my calculations too, I used the same method. Shield piercing has a 7 second cooldown, every second shot with a slow longbow can be piggybacked by shield piercing exactly when cooldown is over.

[superdaveninja]

Wow, Amade, this information is most prudent Shout out to necro and mirac for your input as well.

So, according to Amade's data, the ratio of speed between medium and slow is 2.5 seconds to 3.5 seconds, or just 2.5:3.5. So, 2.5: 3.5 = 5:7 = 1: 7/5 = 1:1 2/5, or 1:1.4, which can also be read at 40%. In plain terms, the medium speed is 40% faster than the slow weapon.

So when buying a weapon, one must examine the damage/ second capabilities of each weapon, as the slow weapon will be inflated due to its slower speed, but the medium speed, slightly lower damage per hit but at a faster rate, might in fact have a greater damage per second ratio. So heres where the speed ratio comes in to play. Because the ratio we've found is 1:1.4, we divide the medium weapon's damage by 1 to find the damage/ second, but for the slow weapon, we must divide by 1.4. Then with those figures can we determine if the slow weapon is worth its damage or if medium speed is actually a better deal.

Another, perhaps more simple way we can determine this is simply by taking the medium speed's damage, and applying a 40% bonus to it, and seeing how those figures compare to the slow weapon. For example, say you have a 26-32 med speed. We apply the 40% (speed ratio difference): 26 + 40% (26) = 26 + 10.4 = 36.4 and 32 + 40% (32) = 32 + 12.8 = 44.8.
Therefore, in order for a slow weapon to as good or better than a medium weapon, it would have to do approx 36.4 - 44.8, which usually does not occur, and so the medium weapon is the better deal.

In conclusion, the medium speed usually does more damage than the slow weapon.

[Miraculix]

dang :/

I sure hope that's not the case... I've been using slow weapons all the time

[amade]

Originally Posted by superdaveninja

So when buying a weapon, one must examine the damage/ second capabilities of each weapon, as the slow weapon will be inflated due to its slower speed, but the medium speed, slightly lower damage per hit but at a faster rate, might in fact have a greater damage per second ratio. So heres where the speed ratio comes in to play. Because the ratio we've found is 1:1.4, we divide the medium weapon's damage by 1 to find the damage/ second, but for the slow weapon, we must divide by 1.4. Then with those figures can we determine if the slow weapon is worth its damage or if medium speed is actually a better deal.

Another, perhaps more simple way we can determine this is simply by taking the medium speed's damage, and applying a 40% bonus to it, and seeing how those figures compare to the slow weapon. For example, say you have a 26-32 med speed. We apply the 40% (speed ratio difference): 26 + 40% (26) = 26 + 10.4 = 36.4 and 32 + 40% (32) = 32 + 12.8 = 44.8.
Therefore, in order for a slow weapon to as good or better than a medium weapon, it would have to do approx 36.4 - 44.8, which usually does not occur, and so the medium weapon is the better deal.

In conclusion, the medium speed usually does more damage than the slow weapon.

Sorry for the double post.

I should reiterate that my figures are "rough", in which the only one I'm 99% sure of is that the slow longbow's rate is 3.5sec. Also, one can't compare bows by it's damage/sec only because of other factors, such as a tradeoff between range and damage. There are slow longbows with range 25 which are more powerful than a range 30 longbow of the same speed. Then there are several types of longbows with same speed and range but apparently differing accuracy/power. I wish I knew what each type of longbow is supposedly good or bad at (types such as impale, execution, projection, elven, etc) instead of just range and speed.

[Barandan]

Originally Posted by amade

That shouldn't be the case, your own weapon speed shouldn't change at all regardless of enemy/mob difficulty. Only certain buffs/debuffs may affect your weapon speed. It may be you're experiencing some unnoticeable lag while fighting mobs, this is evident during laggier times when you may strike 2-3 times in a row before the mob hits you back a few times in a row or vice versa.

I agree that it shouldn't be the case, but I don't really think I was lagging. I was attacking "hard" and "normal" mobs at random. And every time against "hard" mobs there was a speed difference between the two weapons, as expected. (But the difference I saw was not as high as some in this thread thought they were seeing. and not a big enough difference to over come the damage difference between the two weapons when calculating damage per time)

And the surprise was that, every time I attacked a "normal" mob I saw no difference in the speeds of the medium and slow weapons. But that could have been because killing in 4 hits was just fast enough to mask the difference.

Originally Posted by Katiechan

I always use medium or fast during combat. On chases or vs. fort doors I might use a slow for those critical hits.
But IMO slow just causes spell casting to drag way too much to be used all of the time.

Unfortuanately I haven't found a fast 2 handed weapon for my barbarian or I'd probably use one too.
And as I've said, the apparent "damage per time" advantage that I saw for the slow weapon may not come into play or work the same way in PvP.

[Stefanwulf]

One thing that struck me reading this thread over is that damage resistance might play a huge factor here. If the combat algorithm is such that resistance/armor on the part of the target is applied against every attack (which is a really common way of doing these things), then a fast weapon may be multiplying the points of damage resisted by the same factor as the points of damage done.

In essence, one possible video game formula of finding damage on an attack would ATTACK - ARMOR, if you can attack X times per round, then it's suddenly X(ATTACK-ARMOR), which means the best speed to use is going to vary considerably depending on the extent to which you overpower their armor. If you're doing 55 damage and they have 5 armor, then each extra attack per second is going to net you 50 more points of damage. If you do 55 damage and they have 40 armor, then you're far better off switching to the bow that does 1.5 times the damage at the same rate rather than the one that attacks 1.5 times as often.

1*(82-40) = 42 dps
vs
1.5*(55-40) = 22.5 dps

I'm not sure if Regnum is using this basic attack-armor calculation anywhere (obviously there's other factors and some randomness even if they are), but it just struck me as an aspect which makes this more interesting and less certain, particularly in pvp.