Nibiru? Wow..

[Torcida]

Originally Posted by Archonaut

A measurement error? Damn, has been all over the news here, that was the #1 topic, but when they find out it was an error they tell you nothing. #Media.

They thought it could PERHAPS be a measurment error because it happens once in a while but the funny thing is they tested it some time ago for the second time and the Higgs-thingy once again was travelling with more speed then Light now what are the odds off 2 measurment errors?

Originally Posted by Archonaut

the Koran

There are more things explained in the Quran before scientists were able to explain it for example the world is a Circle and the Earth spins arround the Sun these are 2 crucial things mentioned in the Quran

[Arafails]

Originally Posted by Archonaut

Yes there is 1 thing though, how do you explain that some religions like Islam knew scientific things written in the Holy Book 'Koran' before scientists actually found out about it? For example, The Earth's Athmosphere .. They found out about that more than 1400 years ago? Or Things like the origin of the universe(the big bang). Remember, the Koran was written 1400 years ago, how long do scientists actually know this? These thing Amaze me!

Uh.... Science has been around ever since the first time someone asked "how?"
Something big and obvious... Take the Pyramids, for example. Without science, no can do. Hanging Gardens of Babylon? How you gon' irrigate that with science? (Dear Lord, please rain here and here for approximately 4 hours at sun down, kthxbai)

Proper Biblical examples ... Noah's Ark. The Tower of Babel. Jericho. All these needed some degree of understanding the world to build.

[ayexeyen_]

Originally Posted by Archonaut

Yes there is 1 thing though, how do you explain that some religions like Islam knew scientific things written in the Holy Book 'Koran' before scientists actually found out about it?

The fact that the Earth was spheric was well know in ancient time.
The flat Earth is a misconception: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_the_Flat_Earth

However, interpreter some "unclear/smoky" sutras as a proof that koran have a point is wrong. Religion is a question of faith not of proofs. Science and reality is a question of proofs instead.

[Archonaut]

Originally Posted by Arafails

Uh.... Science has been around ever since the first time someone asked "how?"
Something big and obvious... Take the Pyramids, for example. Without science, no can do. Hanging Gardens of Babylon? How you gon' irrigate that with science? (Dear Lord, please rain here and here for approximately 4 hours at sun down, kthxbai)

Proper Biblical examples ... Noah's Ark. The Tower of Babel. Jericho. All these needed some degree of understanding the world to build.

Either you misread my post or just misunderstood it, It's not about that they've studied science but What Kind of level their Science was. Again, check the links almost all of them were 'figured' out a lot laten than when the Quran/Koran was created.

[UmarilsStillHere]

Just because some odd lines sound like they could sort of be interpreted to to referencing modern ideas it does not mean they are. For every vaguely accurate metaphor you find in any religious texts there are 5 examples of gods being born from each others belly buttons or men coming back from death.

[Seher]

Originally Posted by Archonaut

Yes there is 1 thing though, how do you explain that some religions like Islam knew scientific things written in the Holy Book 'Koran' before scientists actually found out about it? For example, The Earth's Athmosphere .. They found out about that more than 1400 years ago? Or Things like the origin of the universe(the big bang). Remember, the Koran was written 1400 years ago, how long do scientists actually know this? These thing Amaze me!

Our middle ages (Christendom... ugh) have slowed down or even reversed progress a lot. The flat earth just being the most prominent example. But yes, such things amaze me, too, that's why I love Ancient Greece.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomism#Greek_atomism
Anaximander already had the idea of life developing in water.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anaxima...n_of_humankind
Etc. Sophists are very interesting as well. I just love Callicles (lol@the article, but at least the core information is there )

[Torcida]

Originally Posted by Seher

Our middle ages (Christendom... ugh) have slowed down or even reversed progress a lot. The flat earth just being the most prominent example.

Well not really think about the Amazing Al-Andalus society a Time of a exceptionally ammount of tolerance Christians building mosques and Muslims building churches and a time were science (encouraged by the Muslim leaders) had a huge boost

[UmarilsStillHere]

Originally Posted by Torcida

Well not really think about the Amazing Al-Andalus society a Time of a exceptionally ammount of tolerance Christians building mosques and Muslims building churches and a time were science (encouraged by the Muslim leaders) had a huge boost

And that children, is how to set one example against several hundred years of repression of learning, knowledge, free thinking ...

Greece, Rome and their similar counterparts were seeped in religion but also in learning, the citys or Rome or Athens themselves were masterworks of engineering for their time.

Somewhere along the line though the church got too powerful (at least in Europe, Papal states etc) and through their repression we had the dark ages, 100s of years where we learned nothing, forgot plenty, and the entire region pretty much became filthy villages wrapped around rich nobles.

Thankfully we eventually had the Renaissance, where although the church was still a dominant factor, people started to question things that had been set as facts for as centurys, such as the medical ideas of Galen, the human experience is about progress and learning, the christian church said don't learn, don't progress, the ancients were better than you, better than us, they were right about everything, this is as good as it gets. (Farming pigs in your crappy little hut living in your own filth while we and the puppet-kings drink fine wine in palaces) That is unforgivable.

[Psynocide]

Originally Posted by Umaril

the christian church said don't learn, don't progress, the ancients were better than you, better than us, they were right about everything, this is as good as it gets. (Farming pigs in your crappy little hut living in your own filth while we and the puppet-kings drink fine wine in palaces) That is unforgivable.

It isn't quite as black and white as you would paint it.
Perspective defines and in this case, deviates from your example.
To cast religion as a whole in an infamous light - both past and present - is a generalization. I will not deny that progression of knowledge was hindered to a certain extent during particularly dogmatic times - certain discoveries and controversial theories repressed as it suited one religion or another.
In particular the Papal Faith during the renaissance was oppressive at best, more of a scheming syndicate than a benevolent faith.
This is only human nature, one man will say one thing, another might say otherwise - it takes quite an ample amount of humility to admit you are wrong, easier to disregard a refutation.
For this reason I also say to hold a grudge would be unreasonable as well as pointless. We need to measure ourselves anyway.

Going back to my original point however, not everyone would agree.
You cannot say for certain what is beneficial for our race as a whole where knowledge is concerned. Some may argue a bit of repression may be necessary to provide cognition, other may not wish to know at all - it may sound alien to you but I'm sure some people are content to just get on with life in their own little bubble.
This is the curse of our little sentient species; no one thinks alike and no one likes to be told what they should think, much less have someone attempt to think for them.
Though most will deny it, we all have our own little bubble - filled with choice people we allow ourselves to acknowledge for one reason or another and select pieces of knowledge that the inhabitance of said bubble are conscious of as even those with the broadest of mindsets will deny certain information, whether because they simply cannot handle it or because of the previously mentioned dislike of being proven wrong.

I could go into far greater depth on the topic you broached in your last sentence but I'd rather not.
Suffice to say, it is forgivable.
We all err, if we cannot forgive one another this inexorable trait, then we must forget - if we cannot manage this.. Well, this is the ink that the darker pages of history are written in.

Now that, is something I hold in contempt.

[Torcida]

Originally Posted by Umaril

And that children, is how to set one example against several hundred years of repression of learning, knowledge, free thinking ...

Greece, Rome and their similar counterparts were seeped in religion but also in learning, the citys or Rome or Athens themselves were masterworks of engineering for their time.

Somewhere along the line though the church got too powerful (at least in Europe, Papal states etc) and through their repression we had the dark ages, 100s of years where we learned nothing, forgot plenty, and the entire region pretty much became filthy villages wrapped around rich nobles.

Thankfully we eventually had the Renaissance, where although the church was still a dominant factor, people started to question things that had been set as facts for as centurys, such as the medical ideas of Galen, the human experience is about progress and learning, the christian church said don't learn, don't progress, the ancients were better than you, better than us, they were right about everything, this is as good as it gets. (Farming pigs in your crappy little hut living in your own filth while we and the puppet-kings drink fine wine in palaces) That is unforgivable.

So according to you everyone in the middle-ages were uneducated fools? What about a 1000 year lasting empire? The East Roman (Byzantine Empire) the most advanced Christian nation at its time and lets take a look at the muslim empire's Al-Andalus (Moorish empire) the Ottoman Empire Saladin's empire since I don't have much time now I can't explain you in detail how extremely advanced these (RELIGOUS) nations were.

You simply don't know alot about history otherwise you wouldn't be say nonsense like you are now.