RNG update at Amun!

[pieceofmeat]

Originally Posted by Frosk

Hey all!

First off, this sounds very promising, im excited about it again.


I like the one layer approach to things.

Maybe its a later topic but, what about item bonuses, stats, buffs that boost hit chance and spell focus?

I think they should be kept in, but be converted into an absolute "positive" value to counter the opponents absolute evade, resist and block chance.

Say base hit chance is always 100% unbuffed, so say you end with 110% hit chance with all bonuses, then everyone below 10% evade chance have 0% evade chance in reality or 20% evade chance have 10% evade chance in reality.

So essentially "absolute" is just a term for a one layer chance, spells that are meant to be truly absolute would need to be high enough to never go below 100% no matter what opponent stats and debuffs you may get hit with.

[LawZ]

Originally Posted by Frosk

Hey all!

...

Having said this, let's move on to the first topic!

Resistance, Evasion and Block Chance System:

Due to technical, interpretation, balancing and gameplay terms, we'll try out a different focus on this system.
This change will make combat be determined by only 1 layer of calculations to decide whether if a player must, for example, evade or not, instead of the 2 layers that's being used today.
The objective will remain the same: to make resistances, evades and blocks show up with a low rate, and that they can only change the flow of a combat situation (pvp or group) if they're triggered with the use of powers.

At this point I have to comment that the new RGN system seems more robust than the previous one, and especially in the case of low number of hits. Users in this post, as well as from the Ra server on the corresponding spanish thread, have basically confirmed it.

Originally Posted by Frosk

In order to quickly brief you guys up:
As Adrian explained somewhere out there in a post, to determine when a player must evade an attack (let's use evade, but it applies for the other 2 things) first checks if he/she has an Absolute Evasion modifier active.
If he/she doesn't, then checks the Base Evasion stat (the one given by items, powers, etc) and with this value decides the character's fate.
It's pretty complicated in a technical level, it's hard to explain ingame with simple feedback and... well it's basically annoying.

Apart from "annoying", was the old system also more server-resource consuming? I am asking this, cause by translating some posts of Adrian from the corresponding spanish thread, he implied that the old system was imposing with higher burden on the server. I guess you are still searching of it, but let's hope that the new RGN system will also lead to less server lag in overall, which will be quite visible from the user point of view.

Originally Posted by Frosk

What we want to do is to simply reduce the whole system to 1 unique layer, easy to understand and "manipulate" from a user point of view, by using powers, items, builds, etc.

To achieve this, all pasive powers, attributes, and powers like Escapist, will give Absolute Evasion chances.
This means that the user will see a real % value, which will determine what chances he/she has to evade.
In other words, if your character has, let's say, 15% evasion chance, is absolute. You could practically evade 15 hits out of 100 incoming blows.
This does not mean that you're always going to evade 15 hits out of 100 attacks, but is a real percentage that shows you what are your probabilities.


This absolute evasion value will also be upgradeable of course by using powers such as Escapist.
If you have 15% absolute evade, and cast Escapist that grants 100% absolute evade, you'll end up with 115% (which is capped at 100%), and lets you evade everything.
The new thing about this is that absolute evasion does not need to be always 100%, as you can see in "absolute" powers now available in live servers. They can also be set with any other different value between 0 and 100.

This means that if we create a debuff that removes 8% absolute evade, if you had 15% you'll go all the way down to 7%.
If we create a buff that grants you 20% absolute evade, you'll end up with 35%.
As you can see, it's pretty straightforward.

Besides this, you'll also be able to porcentually enhance your absolute Evade chance, with other skills (non passive), like "Dodge", or by using items like leggings with Evasion bonuses.
Considering this, if for example you have 15% absolute evade and cast "Dodge", which has a +30% Evade Chance (Non absolute), you'll now have 19.5% Absolute Evade Chance.
This is because this 30% affects the base you already have. Since 30% of 15 is 4.5, then 15 + 4.5 = 19.5

The same goes the other way, if someone reduces your Evasion chance in 40%; it'll be 15% minus this 40%, which means 15 - 6 = 9

The proposed evasion/resist/block system seems rational and pretty straightforward, as you mentioned. But, as a player, I would like to have a correct and uniform description on all spells. I.e., which spells give Absolute evasion/resist/block, which spells give Relative to base evasion/resist/block. This has to be done once and for all.

And at this point, I would like to see this getting extended to all the other spells as well. Which spells are based on Total Damage Attack and which are based on Weapon Damage. And how Total Damage Attack is defined anyway? Does it include, for example, Recharged Arrows or not?

All these have to be clarified, if we like boasting that we do have a straightforward spell and evasion/resist/block system.

Originally Posted by Frosk

...

---

On the other hand, we're also working in everything involving Criticals.
There's a high chance we're not going to continue the Crit Dmg changes included right now in Amun, as they require a lot of work and fixes and time.
It's a pretty good idea to include sometime in the future, but it needs more attention and analysis.

As for now, we're solely working in Crit Chances. We'll upload changes related to this very soon.

---

As I have pointed out in previous posts and ingame discussion, the Critical Damage Idea was poorly designed at the time being and would definitely hinder the RGN patch on live servers. So, i agree that it should not be further developed at this moment.

Of course the big question here is what will be the fate of Hit Chance, since on the new system is considered as 100% (if I am not mistaken). With what Attribute will it be replaced on spells/gems/armor/weapons? Critical chance or Spell Focus (and Evasion / Spell Resistance) could be an idea for melee/archers and mages, respectively. I guess we have to wait on this a bit more.

I have some questions at this point:
1. If NGD abandons the idea of Critical Damage, it will return back to the formula of (1+1/3) * Normal_Hit ? Or will this be revised as well ?
2. Assuming that HC is 100% on all players, does it mean that a low level player could land hits on a high lvl player on the same success rate as with a high lvl player? This is not necessarily bad, but it could lead to some weird situations, for example on boss raids, where low lvl toons could have a bigger impact than the expected one, since they could land hits (and possibly spells too?) with much higher ease. A comment on this would be appreciated.
3. Will NGD at the final patch give us some more insight regarding Spell Focus / Spell Resistance? I would like to see the corresponding percent on my character sheet, plus some other attributes like attack speed, movement speed, and DPS. This has been already mentioned on the thread here.

Thank you, Frosk, for the detailed feedback. All these days I got tired of translating Adrian's posts from the spanish forum thread. I understand that the International community is much smaller than the Spanish-lang one, but we deserve some attention from time to time too.

Best,

[Az.]

What about those classes where HC seems useless, and criticals don't exist? Will the spells get criticals?

May aswell give those classes a special case where any spell can't be dispelled, in place of a critical hit or something equally retarded (e.g DoT does entire damage as direct damage, why not, fuck it). Seems fair with these 50m 1200dmg hits. Funz.

Best,

[pieceofmeat]

Originally Posted by Az.

What about those classes where HC seems useless, and criticals don't exist? Will the spells get criticals?

May aswell give those classes a special case where any spell can't be dispelled, in place of a critical hit or something equally retarded (e.g DoT does entire damage as direct damage, why not, fuck it). Seems fair with these 50m 1200dmg hits. Funz.

Best,

Then you want critical South Cross and Leathal Strike hits as well i guess?

[Ava De Kedavra]

Tried to check stuff on Amun but the system doesn't seem to see my lv 48 warlock and I had to create a level one char....I can't check anything with.
Guess I will just leave it

[LawZ]

Originally Posted by Ava De Kedavra

Tried to check stuff on Amun but the system doesn't seem to see my lv 48 warlock and I had to create a level one char....I can't check anything with.
Guess I will just leave it

Apart from what you say, I would like to notice that the "testinsta60" redeem code seems to have stopped working. NGD should look at that in order to facilitate user tests.

Best,

[Az.]

Originally Posted by pieceofmeat

Then you want critical South Cross and Leathal Strike hits as well i guess?

May as well. 50 range too for SC. To make it fair.

[Frosk]

Hey guys,

We'll be updating Amun in a bit with a new version of the game. Here's this version's changelog!

Changelog 1.12:

Gameplay - System:

- Modified: Realm walls can be recaptured (only by the defending realm).
- Modified: Hit Chance removed, replaced with Critical Chance, which raises the chance shown in the Character Sheet.
- New: Statistical RNG system for combat. Indicated chances now should be accurate both in the short and long run.

Gameplay - Skills:
Warrior:
- Martial Reflexes: Critical Chance changed to 100%/135%/170%/225%/300%. Duration changed to 40/50/60/70/100.
- Rigorous Preparation: Opponent Critical Chance changed to: -15%/-20%/-25%/-30%/-40%. Opponent Miss Chance changed to Evasion Chance: 25%/40%/55%/70%/100%. Cooldown changed to 90 seconds.

Knight:
- Precise Block: Mana cost updated to 150/225/300/375/450.
- Challenge: Opponent Hit Chance changed to Opponent Spell Resistance -25%/-40%/-55%/-70%/-100%. Added Opponent Concentration -10%/-15%/-20%/-25%/-30% Duration changed to 5/5/10/10/15.

Archer:
- Rapid Shot: Hit Chance changed to Critical Chance: -50%.
- Duelist: Hit Chance changed to Critical Chance.
- Hinder: Opponent Hit Chance changed to Opponent Damage Bonus: -2%/-4%/-6%/-8%/-10%.
- Finesse: Opponent Hit Chance changed to Opponent Critical Chance: -10%/-25%/-40%/-60%/-90%. Duration changed to: 10/15/20/25/30.
- Dodge: Evasion Chance changed to 30/35/40/60/90.
- Evasive Tactics: Hit Chance changed to Damage Bonus: -2%/-4%/-6%/-7%/-8%.
- Cat Reflexes: Evade Chance changed to: 5%/10%/15%/20%/25%.
- Spell Elude: Spell Resistance changed to: 20%/50%/90%/140%/200%.
- Escapist: Absolute Evasion Chance changed to: 50%/60%/70%/80%/100%. Duration changed to: 4/4/5/6/8. Cooldown raised to 75 seconds.
- Son of the Wind: Absolute Spell Resist Chance changed to: 50%/60%/70%/80%/100%. Duration changed to: 4/4/5/6/8.

Mage:
- Protection Dome: Spell Resist Chance changed to Absolute Spell Resist Chance: 3%/6%/10%/16%/25%. Duration changed to: 20.
- Curse: Opponent Hit Chance changed to Opponent Critical Chance: -10%/-15%/-20%/-25%/-30%. Opponent Spell Focus changed to Opponent Damage Bonus: -2%/-4%/-6%/-7%/-8%.

Interface:
- New: Spell Resistance is shown in the Character Sheet.

Keep in mind that, as we explained before, absolute chances add up directly. If you have 5%, and the power grants you 50%, you end up with 55%.

Non absolute chances porcentually multiply what you already have. If you have 5%, and the power grants 50%, you come out with 7.5%

That's it! We'll let you know when the server's up with the new version.

Best,

[Raindance]

Precise block 450 mana, hahaha. That will be fun.

[schachteana]

Originally Posted by Frosk

If you have 5%, and the power grants you 50%, you end up with 55%.

If you have 5%, and the power grants 50%, you come out with 7.5%

You do realize that you just wrote the same thing twice, don't you? Shouldn't the spell descriptions AND the spell effect descriptions be distinguishable? It does not seem to me that on every item, every spell, every buff, you can easily see whether it's an abolute or relative bonus. And I fear that as soon as it gets translated into other languages, we'll have a big big mess.