Combat system test - Amun - Phase 2 - Page 15

Fiver · 09-18-2009, 03:03 PM

As a hunter I see the following:

1. track enemy is still a crap shoot=worthless because so unreliable
2. passive speed has no purpose because the attacks requires you to NOT MOVE AT ALL.

Some advice to NGD:

Stop coding...... get your team together and play the game for couple days normal server.
Just play and take forts and hunt and have an invasion attempt....ect

Then do an after action report and noting the obvious major problems.

maybe post you reactions to what you find a problem on forums and have a disscussion.

THEN get some Tylonol ( for the massive headache you'll get ) try the same thing on test server.

I say this because this New Movment System on the test server misses so badly in so many areas it almost like you've never played your own game.

If the problem is that archers/ranged are to overpowered and melee classes have no chace because of the

speed and range then...

1. balance the damage difference/ defense difference between classes a bit and and lower the range of all ranged classes.

anyway good luck ill pop in once in awhile to see how things go, but i hold little hope for what was the best most dynamic game on the market.

Warthog · 09-18-2009, 03:07 PM

For me the bug where all spells cooldowns that were running are reset when a new spell is cast on quickbar is now fixed. TY I can now actually test again without having to try to cast everything from in the spellbook.

A few things I would like to see changed, please can you try lower the cast time of spells like heal dispell, even to 0.5 secs for now, I know this is not major problem an will be adressed in the end but it would help us in seeing how our class will be playable.

Also I really would like to see where movement did not have to be restarted after a spell was cast with cast time. Like if you were on auto-run with a 2 sec spell cast after the cast you would start to run again as soon as possible. I would like this for all classes. Make it so that say you have forward action clicked and holding down you would start running forward again if and only if you held it down. If you released it, then hit again during cast time you would cancel the spell. I think this would help with keeping fights dynamic in how people move around alot, yet also make it so you can stop a long casting spell if the person who you have targeted moves out of range or behind you or w/e. Or if you misclick and start casting the wrong thing you can still cancel it.

Another thought though this is probably not feasible and would in fact mess up what I asked for in the last paragraph, unless canceling of spells was changed to a clickable button and not dependant on movement. Allow all classes to cast while moving (or even just warriors, would need to be tried both ways). They stop to start casting then you can release the forward motion an start moving again while casting. I don't think a speed malus shhould be applied to this, but a mana penalty. So if you cast standing as normal mana cost would be normal. If you cast then started to move again during cast time the cost of mana for the spell would become doubled or tripled then the normal cost for using the advantage of moving while cast time is going. As mana drain is very hard now for warriors and archers, this would make using the cast while moving thing a strategic option IMO. Cause yeah you can get an area off easier where you want it but at the cost of not being able to have much mana left once you get there to do other things other then normal attacks. Yes it would probably be abused but hey, it is the best I can think of atm.

Edit: I will go back to an earlier thought too, I honestly believe that warriors should be given Strategic postion to use with shorter duration and longer cooldown then marksmen have to be able to cast for the initial rush to get themselves into range of ranged classes but not much more then that, once they get there they would have to rely on what they have now and wait say 3 mins to be able to cast it again. The duration could be say 5 seconds longer then duration of onslaught so if that is ever increased then this would be increased as well.

ZericOfGa · 09-18-2009, 03:56 PM

Just retried the classes. I logged into Amun and the first thing i saw was a Knight with a dragon wings bow. Are you serious?? This game has classes. They look different for a reason you take the bow off and it just looks like a knight that too their weapon and shield off.

Suggestion: make swaps in-class only. Meaning, marksmen and hunters can swap armor. Knights and barbs can swap armor, conjs and locks can switch theirs. Its confusing as hell! I do not understand why a hunter or marksman should be able to look like a knight. Its absurd.

Kyro pointed out the animation of "missing" your opponent. I think you said earlier that was an intended animation, however, it will not appear so to new players: they will make the action of attacking, not actually hit, call it a bug, and leave the game. I understand the theory behind it, trying to make it more realistic, but Regnum is a game. Realism isn't truly the goal.

linearguild · 09-18-2009, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZericOfGa

Suggestion: make swaps in-class only. Meaning, marksmen and hunters can swap armor. Knights and barbs can swap armor, conjs and locks can switch theirs. Its confusing as hell! I do not understand why a hunter or marksman should be able to look like a knight. Its absurd.

I agree. Armor gives a visual cue of an enemy's class, so allowing cross-class swaps is too chaotic. In fact, I would prefer that you can only swap items strictly within a subclass (e.g. marksman item attributes cannot be transferred to a hunter item or an archer item, it can be transferred to another marksman item only).

RegnumIrae · 09-18-2009, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chilko

we need to have a "penalty" for launching certain important/powerful spells...

Then remove the casting time from Deflect Proyectiles, Etheral Mantle, Rigorous Preparation and Intuition

Mattdoesrock · 09-18-2009, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by linearguild

I agree. Armor gives a useful visual cue of an enemy's class and allowing cross-class swaps is too chaotic. In fact, I would prefer that you can only swap items strictly within a subclass (e.g. marksman item attributes cannot be transferred to a hunter item or an archer item, it can be transferred to another marksman item only).

Yeah I definatly agree.

On amun early there was a conju in a party hat, who then meteored someone...

If this was carried over to the live servers it'd be chaos, you'd have no idea who is who. Just look at this:

You can make some nice looks though.

Zixmund · 09-18-2009, 05:13 PM

Well I tried to play a bit on Amun with my noob lvl 29 Lock and crap lvl 46 Hunter...With Lock was fine but I tried to grind with my Hunter and it was the most painfull experience in game..I miss the natural > Tap back - Ambush or Tap forward - Dualshot... I hope this update will not cost of the dynamic battles in this great game.

And thank you NGD for discussing it with us and for your hard work on this game

backe · 09-18-2009, 05:22 PM

I definitely agree that item swap should only work on gear within the same sub-class.

I haven't had a chance to play with it yet, but does it work for shields? If so, you could basically "dress" your barb as a knight (with a level 5 warrior shield) and switch weapons once you get in range. That could really mess with peoples heads.

Same goes for Matt's example of a conju dropping a meteor.

UmarilsStillHere · 09-18-2009, 05:24 PM

Armour is a key part of idetifying a subclass, I dont think there should be knights runing about in hunter armour...

Inkster · 09-18-2009, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chilko

we need to have a "penalty" for launching certain important/powerful spells... This is not only part of the balance but of the actual challenge involved in playing melee classes too...

ENERGY BARRIER IS A MAGES ARMOUR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

implement it, give mages an armour with the same protection as the other classes

THIS IMO IS AN ABUSE AS MAGES LOSE OUT! ALL OTHER CLASSES OTHER THAN MAGES HAVE SEMI -DECENT ARMOUR MAGES DO NOT!

FIX THIS NEW BUG BEFORE YOU IMPLEMENT IT

09-18-2009, 03:07 PM	#142
Warthog Apprentice Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 90	For me the bug where all spells cooldowns that were running are reset when a new spell is cast on quickbar is now fixed. TY I can now actually test again without having to try to cast everything from in the spellbook. A few things I would like to see changed, please can you try lower the cast time of spells like heal dispell, even to 0.5 secs for now, I know this is not major problem an will be adressed in the end but it would help us in seeing how our class will be playable. Also I really would like to see where movement did not have to be restarted after a spell was cast with cast time. Like if you were on auto-run with a 2 sec spell cast after the cast you would start to run again as soon as possible. I would like this for all classes. Make it so that say you have forward action clicked and holding down you would start running forward again if and only if you held it down. If you released it, then hit again during cast time you would cancel the spell. I think this would help with keeping fights dynamic in how people move around alot, yet also make it so you can stop a long casting spell if the person who you have targeted moves out of range or behind you or w/e. Or if you misclick and start casting the wrong thing you can still cancel it. Another thought though this is probably not feasible and would in fact mess up what I asked for in the last paragraph, unless canceling of spells was changed to a clickable button and not dependant on movement. Allow all classes to cast while moving (or even just warriors, would need to be tried both ways). They stop to start casting then you can release the forward motion an start moving again while casting. I don't think a speed malus shhould be applied to this, but a mana penalty. So if you cast standing as normal mana cost would be normal. If you cast then started to move again during cast time the cost of mana for the spell would become doubled or tripled then the normal cost for using the advantage of moving while cast time is going. As mana drain is very hard now for warriors and archers, this would make using the cast while moving thing a strategic option IMO. Cause yeah you can get an area off easier where you want it but at the cost of not being able to have much mana left once you get there to do other things other then normal attacks. Yes it would probably be abused but hey, it is the best I can think of atm. Edit: I will go back to an earlier thought too, I honestly believe that warriors should be given Strategic postion to use with shorter duration and longer cooldown then marksmen have to be able to cast for the initial rush to get themselves into range of ranged classes but not much more then that, once they get there they would have to rely on what they have now and wait say 3 mins to be able to cast it again. The duration could be say 5 seconds longer then duration of onslaught so if that is ever increased then this would be increased as well. Last edited by Warthog; 09-18-2009 at 03:27 PM.

09-18-2009, 05:24 PM	#149
UmarilsStillHere Marquis Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: England Posts: 2,419	Armour is a key part of idetifying a subclass, I dont think there should be knights runing about in hunter armour... __________________ Faith 50 Barb Faithless 50 Lock Umaril 45 Conju Kailas 45 Marks Pel 45 Knight I N Q U I S I T I O N

09-18-2009, 03:03 PM	#141
Fiver Apprentice Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 50	As a hunter I see the following: 1. track enemy is still a crap shoot=worthless because so unreliable 2. passive speed has no purpose because the attacks requires you to NOT MOVE AT ALL. Some advice to NGD: Stop coding...... get your team together and play the game for couple days normal server. Just play and take forts and hunt and have an invasion attempt....ect Then do an after action report and noting the obvious major problems. maybe post you reactions to what you find a problem on forums and have a disscussion. THEN get some Tylonol ( for the massive headache you'll get ) try the same thing on test server. I say this because this New Movment System on the test server misses so badly in so many areas it almost like you've never played your own game. If the problem is that archers/ranged are to overpowered and melee classes have no chace because of the speed and range then... 1. balance the damage difference/ defense difference between classes a bit and and lower the range of all ranged classes. anyway good luck ill pop in once in awhile to see how things go, but i hold little hope for what was the best most dynamic game on the market.

09-18-2009, 03:56 PM	#143
ZericOfGa Pledge Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 42	Just retried the classes. I logged into Amun and the first thing i saw was a Knight with a dragon wings bow. Are you serious?? This game has classes. They look different for a reason you take the bow off and it just looks like a knight that too their weapon and shield off. Suggestion: make swaps in-class only. Meaning, marksmen and hunters can swap armor. Knights and barbs can swap armor, conjs and locks can switch theirs. Its confusing as hell! I do not understand why a hunter or marksman should be able to look like a knight. Its absurd. Kyro pointed out the animation of "missing" your opponent. I think you said earlier that was an intended animation, however, it will not appear so to new players: they will make the action of attacking, not actually hit, call it a bug, and leave the game. I understand the theory behind it, trying to make it more realistic, but Regnum is a game. Realism isn't truly the goal.

09-18-2009, 05:13 PM	#147
Zixmund Apprentice Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 59	Well I tried to play a bit on Amun with my noob lvl 29 Lock and crap lvl 46 Hunter...With Lock was fine but I tried to grind with my Hunter and it was the most painfull experience in game..I miss the natural > Tap back - Ambush or Tap forward - Dualshot... I hope this update will not cost of the dynamic battles in this great game. And thank you NGD for discussing it with us and for your hard work on this game

09-18-2009, 05:22 PM	#148
backe Initiate Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 222	I definitely agree that item swap should only work on gear within the same sub-class. I haven't had a chance to play with it yet, but does it work for shields? If so, you could basically "dress" your barb as a knight (with a level 5 warrior shield) and switch weapons once you get in range. That could really mess with peoples heads. Same goes for Matt's example of a conju dropping a meteor.