balance Update 2011 Stage 1 - Summary

[standistortion]

Think knocks would be better as long cd or high cost spells

[NSer]

Originally Posted by Torcida

A MMORPG without knocks?....Really?

If Exist MMORPG without RPG why there must be knocks ?

[HidraA]

Originally Posted by pauluzz

All that my hunter is good for in fortfights is ambushing a target so marks/ barbs can kill it.
Now that will more or less be taken away, making hunters even more useless in fortfights

Learn to play your hunter and stop complaining about them.....

http://fulga.u-s.ro/fotos/hunters_dmg.png


Ah all complaint about marksman OP armor....guys i think you exagerate...when i played barbarian hightes hit was made with evedim hammer and was at 5-th hit of tfb and was around 1300 dmg.
Now you hit over 2k dmg on mage 1300-1400 normals on marx op armor....
and all screem ...nerf others ,nerf other.

I realy want to see how barbarians will play if knock duration will be reduced.
The true is ,there is no fight bitween barbarian and a class,just knock and target is dead.

Thats is the fight between a class and barbarian :

http://fulga.u-s.ro/fotos/op_marx_armor.png


Removing feint you think will fix that ...i dont think so...will be the same

Anyway i don't play marksman anymore ,i stoped...i made other class...i prepare my self marksman to be nerfred to death because of this stupid complaints.

Now all are skilled for hightes knock wild domain 4/5,ambush 4/5,kick 4/5,feint 4/5....are just exploits of the game and some ppl cant play with out them.

Somehow balance was broken when UM and A01 was nerfred,and this armor fixes.

Long UM prevented the knocks mania,max knock was feint 3.

Duno how it was fixed this armors ,but after this fix barbarians dubled they dmg.So this maked for a knocked targed to be worst.

Marksman was nerfred:uber dmg from 500 now max to 300,all speeds as escapist,mobility was nerfred.SO run basicaly imposible for abrab with 25% speed,and if he has horn 50% speed.DS removed.
And you know what ...noone complaint about marx just because were a few barb but they were able to play they class not only knocks.

Game looks like this:
-Lock vs Lock=fight of meteors
-Lock vs Marks=bow vs meteor
-Lock vs barb=knocks vs slow
-Marks vs barb =speed(UM) vs CC
-Barb vs knight =MS(knocks) vs (MS)knocks
-Conj=dead meat

[NSer]

Originally Posted by standistortion

Think knocks would be better as long cd or high cost spells

Erm.. dunno but if MOST POWERFUL crowd control cost like a s**t....

[standistortion]

Something else with knocks, they are one of the first skills available for warriors and archers so get learned as a primary attack. Don't think it would make a huge difference to have defensive or evasive skills instead of knocks at early levels but might encourage different styles of play.

[HidraA]

Originally Posted by standistortion

Something else with knocks, they are one of the first skills available for warriors and archers so get learned as a primary attack. Don't think it would make a huge difference to have defensive or evasive skills instead of knocks at early levels but might encourage different styles of play.

I don't think this will stop this knock mania.Allrady to skill for knocks 5,you need to put your discipline at lvl 19.
But because is hight impact spell all make that because worth to doit.A knock 5 and you are disabled afk dieng.

[Vroek]

Originally Posted by HidraA

Learn to play your hunter and stop complaining about them.....

http://fulga.u-s.ro/fotos/hunters_dmg.png

I agree, hunters are not half as bad as they are made out to be by some people.
They really have to stop comparing themselves to marksmen.

On the other hand marksmen really could get toned down a little.
For example longer CD on WS, make strategic not stack with other resists.
Little things just to take some of the excess away without ruining the class.

Learn to play? As if you can do that kind of damage a on marks that know how to handle his defensive buffs.

[bois]

I do agree that removing knocks would mean that balance would have to be redone and a lot of spells adjusted. But guess what?
We need that anyway!

It is not only CC that needs to be looked at. More than half the spells need an overhaul. Sure we look at knock, but other CC spells need adjusting and practically all the Hit chance modifier spells need looking at again. Resistance buff spells need looking at. NGD changed a lot of the underlying equations and figures and left the old spells intact. Hence, we are having some issues.

Knock maybe the hot topic today, slow will be tomorrow, etc. etc. Like I said numerous times, fix one conceptual problem and it exposes the next glaring one. Knock became nasty when they removed your ability to evade, block etc under knock. This was the single biggest factor that kept knock in check.

The best idea thus far for knock is this :
Let the knock duration be static. So for example* Kick is 3 seconds on all levels.
Let a second component be the one that scales. So for example will *domain is 3 second knock all levels and has a scaling damage component. Optionally there can be a companion Debuff component like -STR%
*Disclaimer, these are random examples and not meant to be actual. I know how people like to trip off here.

[HidraA]

Originally Posted by bois

Knock maybe the hot topic today, slow will be tomorrow, etc. etc. Like I said numerous times, fix one conceptual problem and it exposes the next glaring one. Knock became nasty when they removed your ability to evade, block etc under knock. This was the single biggest factor that kept knock in check.

i am agree with this...that why a wille back suggested revamp of all CC by impact on classes.And this can be adjusted faster using categorys instead of 1 spell.
Wee going nowhere nerfing only feint and BoW.

[53453467734534]

You´re right. This is very important.

Don´t remove options! NGD!

Make unused spells better, create new interesting spells, invent or improve SELECTIVE and SITUATIONAL (Offensive beacon is/was stupid) counter abilities and protective spells, adjust and balance existing CCs and abilities
in order that they aren´t overpowered but aren´t underpowered either.
This is a fine line. If you remove options, you will remove game content.
No reason to play a game without much content.
People will always complain about things that work against them.
An Ego-Shooter with only one weapon is balanced but not very interesting, a real time strategy game with only one race is balanced but boring.

I am saying this, because you (NGD) are considering changes that remove options, and because people want to remove knockdowns completely from the game. I am not saying, that knockdowns don´t need a rebalance (i made or supported several suggestions: time reduction, usable abilities while knocked, situational and specific immunity against different CCs), but if you remove them some or most people will have less fun, because of fewer options, and others will complain about new things that work against them.