New Balance - Page 2

TheMessenger · 07-13-2010, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ieti

Here we go on conjurers(warjurers) again. Summons as they are are needed to grind. Conjurer without summon is sloow to grind. I know it i grind second or even third conju atm. Zark as it is now is not so big on HP - just jump on it and kill it. Then you can handle warju pretty well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMessenger

well to stop warjurs would be to stop conjs from grinding really but I always thought a conj should support ppl to lvl not go warju and grind faster than any class so I cant disagree

its just conjs would need to get more xp for it...maybe add an xp of "+supp" for supporting

....there really is no reason a conjurer should have a summon and the fact that the summon is oped makes it worse. You say the zark doesnt have alot of health but neither does a troll, but yet people complain about those saying they are oped. Its not the troll nor the hunter that is oped its the spells that can be used on the pet. While a zarkit/warju is just plain oped. How are you suppose to kill it (as a melee) if you cant reach it? (pricky, will domain, mind push etc.) or are out of mana (mana burn, SS, energy borrow) and how are you suppose to kill it as a ranged class if you cant attack? (will domain, mana burn, beetle swarm etc.)

ieti · 07-13-2010, 08:41 AM

As for me i do not care for summons. I have my conju level 50 and my Ra conju level 38. Still second needs grind, but i can handle it. Real problem is that if you remove summons and nearly force conjurers to rely on others to gain XP this will kill that class. I'm already sick of situations when i get necro - amb before kill or some mob kill me by accident. In this situations a need to BEG someone to help me clean necro which i do not think is nice. Yes people help, but this situation is abusing for people that play this nice class. If you need to rely to others to gain XP this will be even more abusing and even more will extinct this class.

Another point see warjurers like Raxa - he do not use summon, but is more unplesant than 2/3 of warjurers. This guy have skills and use them right. So you will call for next wave of nerfs?

Zas_ · 07-13-2010, 09:07 AM

Often i see that pets and summons are needed to grind, which is true atm, but still they create imbalance at war.

So it always ends in "don't nerf summon/pet" ... here an easy solution:

- divide summon/pet damages by 2 on characters
- keep same damage on mobs

Shwish · 07-13-2010, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zas_

- divide summon/pet damages by 2 on characters
- keep same damage on mobs

i like this

maybe the same for knights vs non-boss mobs

Minorian · 07-13-2010, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMessenger

They dont need a 2hit-300norm every 2sec or w.e it is pet. Alot of these warjus have Will domain 5, prick 5, push 1-5, mana burn 3-5, energy borrow 3-5, steel skin etc. They have more than enough powers at their hands and having a summon like this really makes them more oped than they are.

Also the hunter I played hit 200s max (w/o head of the pack) on mages and 24s on a buffed marks...yet ppl complain about my troll that does the norms I need it to do to kill anyone with an sb.

Conjurers have a very small output of damage, except SM

I don't think I'd be able to grind with a nerfed summon. But I do agree to make them less powerful in war=less warjus. Maybe make them good against mobs? A simple damage increase for mobs and malus for players would fix the problem.

Quote:

....there really is no reason a conjurer should have a summon and the fact that the summon is oped makes it worse. You say the zark doesnt have alot of health but neither does a troll, but yet people complain about those saying they are oped. Its not the troll nor the hunter that is oped its the spells that can be used on the pet. While a zarkit/warju is just plain oped. How are you suppose to kill it (as a melee) if you cant reach it? (pricky, will domain, mind push etc.) or are out of mana (mana burn, SS, energy borrow) and how are you suppose to kill it as a ranged class if you cant attack? (will domain, mana burn, beetle swarm etc.)

Why shouldnt a conju have a summon? Care to explain it? And are you freaking blind? I see lvl 50 zarkits go down in 1 hit from barbs. Thats not much health, maybe around 1000. Trolls I see taking 2-3 hits, so I'd say about 2.5k health. Big difference. Yes it is also the buffs for a pet, they are way too good. Warjus have no SS. As a barb how about UM? WHen I used to be warju, if an knight came at me and Ao1'd, I would more often than not run. Oh, and SS is a lock spell. Yes, as a range class you have less of a chance as warriors. But it is still very possible. As a marks, keep your range at all costs. Everything in mental has 25 range, so why not sty at 40 range?

As a hunter, sneak up under camo. Confuse warju, bestial the shit outa summon, and it's all over. Ambush, stun fist, it wont take long. As a lock, if you can't steal the summon (if you can, you destroy the pvp, it's a landslide) try "wasting" a sultar. Having them both down is a huge advantage, and 1 spell will finish the zark, then you can meteor conju, use mental cc's, kill their mana locks have endless options. I won't explain to as another warju.

THe only time I personaly see zarkits are in the hands of locks. Who thought of that sh** XD

Pnarpa · 07-13-2010, 09:58 AM

I think it's true that by nerfing summons you'll see a lot less warjurers in war, but also less conjurers altogether. The way it is right now the conjurer class (full support) is unenjoyable to play. You always have to rely on others to get to places or to grind off necro.

When a bridge is camped and you're in full support, then basically you can't go anywhere unless you have some nice realmmates wich is rare. I can understand why people go with the warjurer setup because of this.

time-to-die · 07-13-2010, 10:23 AM

Hi,
How you want a grind a conj with out a summoning? they just have few good skills for atk. But the normal hits are just to low for with out a summoning.
(sorry about my bad english)
with kind regards

TheMessenger · 07-13-2010, 10:53 AM

Ok since most did not read my comment of how a conj would lvl w/o a summon

A conj is a support class and NGD has stated they want mages being the hardest classes to grind and (I think) also the least played, warriors the easiest to grind and archers inbetween. This is because when you watch movies you see the most of warriors, than archers and mages are usually few unless its a huge battle.

So therefore a conj should not have a summon because, once again, they are a support class and are suppose to be the hardest class to grind. Having a summon basically destroys this vision. Now for what I said about them lvling w/o a summon, NGD should give conj more xp for Support grinding (and if you do this in a grp of ppl instead of just 1 person you actually get a decent amount of xp already) and give more xp for mobs overall.

If you don't like being dependent on other people for protection than why the fuck are you playing the main support class in the game? As a conj you hold people by the balls, so to speak. If they don't help you all you have to say is don't expect anything from me at a fort and 9 times out of 10 they will change their attitude.

ieti · 07-13-2010, 11:11 AM

Problem is sometimes there are no parties or ppl willing for support. What to do then sit and die from boredom? Most of times there are no people who protect you in battle, so unless you have partner conju who shares your faith and you support each other, you are dead meat for seconds. I telled this in several threads conju can not be protected it is nearly impossible, so most of the times if you see alive conju in bad situation it is because of some lucky coincidence or fast reactions.

You played conju before i know it and you know that if there is not war support conjurer is dead char. You can only chat at cs. That is reason more and more conjus hop to warjus, make warlocks, hunters, marks...

Conju is most stresfull class in battle - you are yelled, hammered by enemies, kill the conju kill the conju! And you want to make us ever more dependent from others. Do we deserver this?

Lately one more of our conjus turned to warju - Eufira if i remember good

Mr_Egg · 07-13-2010, 03:35 PM

I knew the conversation would go this way from the first couple of posts, so I've only skim-read most of it, and this may have already been said:

Yes, reduce damage from summons, but also increase experience gained from support spells.

This way, more conjurers will grind with a support setup, meaning there's more teamwork in the wz, the conjurers that grad have a better idea of how to support, and the game would generally be more fun, since when they step out into the warzone, they'll have some idea of what they're doing and increase how long fights last, because players on both sides would be well supported.

Conjurers, being the main support class, should not be insanely hard to grind, but summons can give them too great an advantage.

Also, @ warjus in general - for crying out loud, DI your zarks

07-13-2010, 08:41 AM	#12
ieti Count Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Sofia, Bulgaria Posts: 1,374	As for me i do not care for summons. I have my conju level 50 and my Ra conju level 38. Still second needs grind, but i can handle it. Real problem is that if you remove summons and nearly force conjurers to rely on others to gain XP this will kill that class. I'm already sick of situations when i get necro - amb before kill or some mob kill me by accident. In this situations a need to BEG someone to help me clean necro which i do not think is nice. Yes people help, but this situation is abusing for people that play this nice class. If you need to rely to others to gain XP this will be even more abusing and even more will extinct this class. Another point see warjurers like Raxa - he do not use summon, but is more unplesant than 2/3 of warjurers. This guy have skills and use them right. So you will call for next wave of nerfs? __________________ RA \| Ignis \| Lilla My \| Conjurer \| EVIL IGNIS ROCK Horus \| Syrtis \| ieti \| Conjurer \| INQUISITION \| LONG GONE

07-13-2010, 09:07 AM	#13
Zas_ Count Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: France Posts: 1,024	Often i see that pets and summons are needed to grind, which is true atm, but still they create imbalance at war. So it always ends in "don't nerf summon/pet" ... here an easy solution: - divide summon/pet damages by 2 on characters - keep same damage on mobs __________________ Annavilya / War-Luck (Haven)

07-13-2010, 09:58 AM	#16
Pnarpa Master Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 484	I think it's true that by nerfing summons you'll see a lot less warjurers in war, but also less conjurers altogether. The way it is right now the conjurer class (full support) is unenjoyable to play. You always have to rely on others to get to places or to grind off necro. When a bridge is camped and you're in full support, then basically you can't go anywhere unless you have some nice realmmates wich is rare. I can understand why people go with the warjurer setup because of this. __________________ INQUISITION

07-13-2010, 11:11 AM	#19
ieti Count Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Sofia, Bulgaria Posts: 1,374	Problem is sometimes there are no parties or ppl willing for support. What to do then sit and die from boredom? Most of times there are no people who protect you in battle, so unless you have partner conju who shares your faith and you support each other, you are dead meat for seconds. I telled this in several threads conju can not be protected it is nearly impossible, so most of the times if you see alive conju in bad situation it is because of some lucky coincidence or fast reactions. You played conju before i know it and you know that if there is not war support conjurer is dead char. You can only chat at cs. That is reason more and more conjus hop to warjus, make warlocks, hunters, marks... Conju is most stresfull class in battle - you are yelled, hammered by enemies, kill the conju kill the conju! And you want to make us ever more dependent from others. Do we deserver this? Lately one more of our conjus turned to warju - Eufira if i remember good __________________ RA \| Ignis \| Lilla My \| Conjurer \| EVIL IGNIS ROCK Horus \| Syrtis \| ieti \| Conjurer \| INQUISITION \| LONG GONE

07-13-2010, 03:35 PM	#20
Mr_Egg Apprentice Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Anywhere but Trelle... Posts: 66	I knew the conversation would go this way from the first couple of posts, so I've only skim-read most of it, and this may have already been said: Yes, reduce damage from summons, but also increase experience gained from support spells. This way, more conjurers will grind with a support setup, meaning there's more teamwork in the wz, the conjurers that grad have a better idea of how to support, and the game would generally be more fun, since when they step out into the warzone, they'll have some idea of what they're doing and increase how long fights last, because players on both sides would be well supported. Conjurers, being the main support class, should not be insanely hard to grind, but summons can give them too great an advantage. Also, @ warjus in general - for crying out loud, DI your zarks __________________ proud member of the UNDERDOGS* clan*

07-13-2010, 10:23 AM	#17
time-to-die Baron Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: The netherlands Posts: 722	Hi, How you want a grind a conj with out a summoning? they just have few good skills for atk. But the normal hits are just to low for with out a summoning. (sorry about my bad english) with kind regards

07-13-2010, 10:53 AM	#18
TheMessenger Banned Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 326	Ok since most did not read my comment of how a conj would lvl w/o a summon A conj is a support class and NGD has stated they want mages being the hardest classes to grind and (I think) also the least played, warriors the easiest to grind and archers inbetween. This is because when you watch movies you see the most of warriors, than archers and mages are usually few unless its a huge battle. So therefore a conj should not have a summon because, once again, they are a support class and are suppose to be the hardest class to grind. Having a summon basically destroys this vision. Now for what I said about them lvling w/o a summon, NGD should give conj more xp for Support grinding (and if you do this in a grp of ppl instead of just 1 person you actually get a decent amount of xp already) and give more xp for mobs overall. If you don't like being dependent on other people for protection than why the fuck are you playing the main support class in the game? As a conj you hold people by the balls, so to speak. If they don't help you all you have to say is don't expect anything from me at a fort and 9 times out of 10 they will change their attitude.