Feds tell immigration officers to treat U.S. deserters as criminals

[WhateverUSMC]

Originally Posted by Malevolence

Ah I see. You should of used your head before joining the US army then. Now you don't even have a country and need to feed off of my taxes now. If you joined cause the recruitment officer sold you on it I have to laugh a bit. But what do you expect when your Government dumbs down its citizens. If you really didn't know what you where getting into when you joined, maybe you should of stayed in school a little longer. I commend you that you maybe realized that USA military is just an extension of corporations protecting its foreign interest. Why not go hide in Mexico?? Ah standard of living I guess. I have no respect for you people and I wish you left my country and stooped using us as a place to run away to. We get enough boat loads of Tamil Tigers from a bonafied 3rd world....Whats your excuse? Ignorants period.

For the record I served my Country with distinction.

Sigh. More right-wing parroting. These debates would be far more interesting to me if the conservatives didn't copy each others view points all the time.


'"feed off my taxes" - I have a work permit and am not using your health care system, so invalid complaint.

"If you really didn't know what you where getting into when you joined, maybe you should of stayed in school a little longer." - Damn me for thinking contracts are two-way streets. Oh, wait; they ARE?!

"I have no respect for you people and I wish you left my country" - AH-HA. 'You people'. There's the real reason for your position; hatred and bigotry. Poor parenting is not our fault.

"stooped (?) using us as a place to run away to." - Canada has a proud civil rights history, and the people who like to ignore that fact are part of the problem. I would suggest that you take the GED.

"Whats your excuse? Ignorants (?) period"

Legal Breakdown

1. The UN did not sanction the occupation of Iraq.
2. Since it was not sanctioned, according to the UN Charter, it was a war of aggression.
3. Wars of aggression are illegal (UN Charter again).
4. The UN Charter (pay attension to this Charter; it might be important), and the Nuremburg Principles (which Canada agreed to during the Nazi war crimes trial) both say that soldiers are accountable for what they do, ordered to or not, and that ALL SOLDIERS have a duty to disobey unlawful orders.
5. The Charter states that military members who refuse to fight in an illegal war are, in fact, refugees.
6. Canada IS A SIGNATORY of the UN Charter.

"For the record I served my Country with distinction" - if this is your position as a military member, I have to say; you missed the point of your enlistment. Also; being in a military where you can say 'no, thanks' to a deployment means you have no right to complain about what we do.

As far as serving with distinction goes; we served with distinction; you served with "ignorants".

I served two combat tours in Iraq, and wasn't slated to go back again. How many times did you go to Iraq (the country, not your bed, in case you're confused; don't wanna get too far ahead of you)?

Furthermore; maybe your thoughtless rant would have been more memorable if you ran it through spell check; they have that now, BTW.

Your whole post; spoken like someone who has no idea what he's talking about. However, since your opinion is in the minority, it couldn't possibly matter less.

[Malevolence]

I think you really miss the point of what a standing army is. You don't have the luxury to question orders. Also you are just the idiots that fallow the coattails of real people that have real legitimate issues. You just joined didn't like it and used this as an excuse to get out.

sigh with all the crap you spew I'm surprised you where not kicked out for being a pain in the ass....You would excel as a Union Rep.

Also I have always been a Socialist and absolute secularist.

[Vythica]

Originally Posted by Greyman_tle

Firstly..just to clarify....I DON'T DISAGREE.

right, now my question.

What options were availiable to you before you deserted..ie If when you recieved your orders and went to your CO and stated you were not going to obey them....what would the consequenses be.?..I assume that apart from using force to actually get you on the plane, they can't really make you go ( i may be nieve, not being from the US).

I ask from the standpoint that if you choose to disobey the rules set by society - both in and out of the armed forces, then you must accept - to a certain degree - the consequences of your actions.

1 of my great-uncle's was a concientious objector during WW1. He refused to fight, but still served at the front as a field medic...his other choice was prison. And if the 'war crime' rules of today had been applied then, we'd probably still be holding trials for it.

Sorry, I had to get the retard out of the way before I could answer a genuine question.

Here are the options when given orders to go to Iraq (or anywhere else for that matter) go; or go to jail. That's it, there's no grey area. There is no option to retrain as a medic or anything like that.

I agree that when being civilly disobedient, that you should be willing to accept consequences. On the other hand, when society sets rules in place (such as soldier's right to conscience and that soldiers can be refugees based on that) then society should be expected to uphold those as well. It's irrational to say that "you should expect consequences" when it's actually society who committed; one, to not put soldiers in the situation that we've been put in; and two, to give them protection when they only follow the internationally accepted rules.
Thanks for listening.

[WhateverUSMC]

Originally Posted by Malevolence

I think you really miss the point of what a standing army is. You dont have the luxury to question orders. Also you are just the idiots that fallow the coattails of real people that have real legitimate issues. You just joined didn't like it and used this as an excuse to get out.

sigh with all the crap you spew I'm surprised you where not kicked out for being a pain in the ass....You would excel as a Union Rep.

Also I have always been a Socialist and absolute secularist.

Not only is there the luxury, there is the responsibility, as well.

Stay in school, kids...

[Malevolence]

Anyway you sugar coat your excuses you are a trader to your country and living in mine. Pathetic

[Vythica]

Originally Posted by Malevolence

I think you really miss the point of what a standing army is. You don't have the luxury to question orders. Also you are just the idiots that fallow the coattails of real people that have real legitimate issues. You just joined didn't like it and used this as an excuse to get out.

sigh with all the crap you spew I'm surprised you where not kicked out for being a pain in the ass....You would excel as a Union Rep.

Also I have always been a Socialist and absolute secularist.

Not to further feed the troll, but wars of aggression are fundamentally incompatible with socialism. If you don't believe me, maybe you should read some more Marx.

[Malevolence]

The military does not pay rewards for information received concerning the whereabouts of absentees and deserters. (Exception: If the deserter is also wanted for serious crimes, such as rape or murder, the services sometime offer rewards for information leading to their capture.) However, if you believe you know the whereabouts of someone who is AWOL or has deserted, you can report them to the individual service's Deserter Information Point, who will then determine whether or not the person is in desertion or AWOL status and take appropriate action. The DIP phone numbers are:

• Army: (502) 626-3711/ 3712/3713
• Navy: (847) 688-2106 (or toll free: 1-800-423-7633)
• Marine Corps: (703) 614-3248/3376
• Air Force: (210) 566-3752 (or toll free: 1-800-531-5501)
• Coast Guard: 1-800-986-9678 ext. 3-6600

[Vythica]

Originally Posted by Malevolence

The military does not pay rewards for information received concerning the whereabouts of absentees and deserters. (Exception: If the deserter is also wanted for serious crimes, such as rape or murder, the services sometime offer rewards for information leading to their capture.) However, if you believe you know the whereabouts of someone who is AWOL or has deserted, you can report them to the individual service's Deserter Information Point, who will then determine whether or not the person is in desertion or AWOL status and take appropriate action. The DIP phone numbers are:

• Army: (502) 626-3711/ 3712/3713
• Navy: (847) 688-2106 (or toll free: 1-800-423-7633)
• Marine Corps: (703) 614-3248/3376
• Air Force: (210) 566-3752 (or toll free: 1-800-531-5501)
• Coast Guard: 1-800-986-9678 ext. 3-6600

Thanks. I'm fairly certain that 1) the military knows where I'm at considering I've called them and told them; and 2) I couldn't care less.

[WhateverUSMC]

Originally Posted by Malevolence

The military does not pay rewards for information received concerning the whereabouts of absentees and deserters. (Exception: If the deserter is also wanted for serious crimes, such as rape or murder, the services sometime offer rewards for information leading to their capture.) However, if you believe you know the whereabouts of someone who is AWOL or has deserted, you can report them to the individual service's Deserter Information Point, who will then determine whether or not the person is in desertion or AWOL status and take appropriate action. The DIP phone numbers are:

• Army: (502) 626-3711/ 3712/3713
• Navy: (847) 688-2106 (or toll free: 1-800-423-7633)
• Marine Corps: (703) 614-3248/3376
• Air Force: (210) 566-3752 (or toll free: 1-800-531-5501)
• Coast Guard: 1-800-986-9678 ext. 3-6600

Also irrelevant, since American troops crossing the border to arrest refugee claimants would be an act of war. Also; they have my address, and since they have no juisdiction here, I've invited them for coffee on several occassions.

Since you have no valid arguments (and since you show so much disrespect to those who have fought and died for the freedoms you take for granted), I have no choice but to put you on ignore.

Don't feed the troll, folks.

[Malevolence]

Originally Posted by Vythica

Not to further feed the troll, but wars of aggression are fundamentally incompatible with socialism. If you don't believe me, maybe you should read some more Marx.

Actually maybe you should read more Marx

Genocide arose out of Marx's master-theory of history -- feudalism giving place inevitably to capitalism, capitalism to socialism. The lesser races of Europe -- Basques, Serbs, Bretons and others -- being sunk in feudalism, were counter-revolutionary; having failed to develop a bourgeoisie, they would be two steps behind in the historical process. Engels dismissed them as left-overs and ethnic trash (Voelkerabfall), and called for their extinction.

Karl Marx published an article by Friedrich Engels in Die Neue Rheinische Zeitung announcing that in Central Europe only Germans, Hungarians and Poles counted as bearers of progress. The rest must go. "The chief mission of all other races and peoples, large and small, is to perish in the revolutionary holocaust."