'The' final balance update!

[NotScias]

Originally Posted by TheMessenger

Barbs...low defence? lolwut? +40% resist to a physical damage of their choice (not even counting caution or armor.) My marks hits ~200 on barbs.

But knights have yet ton more defense than barbs and they have blocking abilities, while hunters have much less defense than marks and no extra abilities like evasion should be. Also Barbs' moderate defense is more or less justified because they're melee.

I don't disagree that Marksmen should have less defense than Hunters. But you are saying "range is their defense" so you are just encouraging more pussy marks staying at range 45+ where nobody but other marks can reach them yet you (locks) complain about it all the time. Lame.

Well I agree I don't really like this, but what I don't like the most is that not only Marks have an uber range, loads of CCs, but also have all evasion tools (sotw...) that's really overkill.

Also, no defense for a marks? You do know that a marks will not be out of the range of every other class 100% of the time? With no defense every class will rape them when they get in range, especially if they resist.

You have 0 range slows, .5s range 0 dizzy spell, range 35 freeze that's way over all classes range. Plus acrobatic.

I don't like playing with a range 35 bow and I do not want to be forced to.

Well that may seem a very controversial opinion but the main problem with archers is that there's not enough difference between the subclasses. If you want to use a shield and tank you have to make a knight. If you want to fight in close range with evasion abilities, you should make a hunter, not a marks...

Thiath i know you as lock you want marksman nerfred to death.Is last line in warlock road to other god-mod class.

And Scias, we all know you want every class nerfed except your precious lock.

Warlocks have null defense, less range than archers, no speed, and being spellcasters only. I remind you that NGD greatly improved the Attack Speed of Archers and Warriors and still let Warlocks do the same (pitiful) damage with spells from level 37, gave variable GCD and nerfed CS (and Sultar...). Are gods that imperfect ?
I have formuled my ideas using logic, trying to draw a stronger line between hunters and marks, not what seems OP or not to me, else I'd just have said screw BoW, WS and give sotw to locks. Even ieti suggested more OP stuff for locks than me (eg old Sultar/Wind wall).
Now if only you'd try to do the same instead of mindlessly barking the same useless and mispelled stuff cause I'm stunned by your level of argumentation.

Camo +confuse before any marks can buff + SS=hunter with armor and marks with his half of armor.

If you ever fully read my post you'd have seen I talked about camo and confuse. First, confuse is an archer spell, so marks have access to it aswell, and I proposed it to be nerfed in duration. Secondly, camo + confuse on unbuffed target is surprise attack, and the victim of course won't have great chances to win, but that concerns all surprise attacks from all the classes. What if a marks surprise an unbuffed player with ambush + confuse ? Camo isn't really a big advantage as is, it's more the surprise effect which is totally useless in RvR/non-PvP battles.
SS is shared aswell and can be used against any class... Look more carefully at your spellbook before saying junk.

[bois]

There is no "that Update". No update in the sense of brick and mortar rules that would solve the ills and make everyone happy.
Rather, people speak about a more ethereal concept. To every single person here, "that update" is different. However, the general goals are the same.

1: Balance in all aspects. When I say balance, I do not mean perfect balance. I mean that every single player or group perceives that they have an equal potential chance of success. They may never attain it but they can justify.

2: Fun factor. Every player whether winner or loser wants to log off feeling lifted, entertained and wants to experience that same thrill again, and again. The thrill more than compensates for frustration.

3: A sense of belonging, validity in war groups, able to be the hero at least one time. Having the tools to do so. Knowing that skill counts. They have a place in an ever expanding game. Their emotional investment is not wasted.

4: Growth. Every player wants to know that they have not met the end and that there is something more some tweak, some special equipment something to reach for. Their investment in the game pays dividends over the long term and keeps on giving.

4: Understanding. A lot of players want to be understood, their gripes at least heard. Their input is at least recognised if if it is not used. An expression of changes that are at least moulded from community input.

There is no definitive 'that update'. 'That update' expresses a turning point where the sum total of the will of its users begin to experience a fulfilling experience from each and every facet of the game. At worst, the majority experience a game where the enjoyment far exceeds any frustrations. The problem is that a lot of the old players experienced this already and are suffering from the gradual loss, update by update. The reasons they chose this game evaporate update by update.

Lastly, the concept "that update " came about because of the previous approach of NGD staff. That approach was to push changes through that sometimes were half baked, and left players wondering. Quite often the opinions of the community was discounted and in several instances that same community was proved right. Numerous wonderful suggestions left in the suggestions box were left languishing there.

The concept of "that update" is more a collective expression of frustration with the current development processes, deployment and communication with the community at large.

Regards.

[Raindance]

Originally Posted by Shining-Scias

Warlocks have null defense, less range than archers, no speed, and being spellcasters only.

And so what if they are only spell casters? I think that's the role of the class, unless you want Warlocks to go back to the SM era? Which I know you were against. This statement might be terribly overused, but once a warlock can land in a Will Domain you are finished. You have two freezes, many DoT's, Darkness... and range, small but yes it's there, it's no trouble to land in a Meteor or Pricking Ivy however. If an average every day Warlock doesn't know how to utilize all his spells correctly with successful timing he shouldn't be playing that class, maybe he should become a brainless Marks turret.

Warlocks aren't the most OP class at the time being, but yes they're strong and deadly and have weaknesses as well. BoW needs a lower duration, WS needs a longer cooldown and barbs need less speed overall. Those are the only things I'd ever consider nerfing since I don't like nerfing, because there are better ways to improve the weak classes rather than nerfing OP ones.

Now if only you'd try to do the same instead of mindlessly barking the same useless and mispelled stuff cause I'm stunned by your level of argumentation.

I don't know... please point out where I've misspelled anything in my post. Seems to me you have more errors than I supposedly have.


And I'm all for Wind Wall getting a boost.

[UmarilsStillHere]

Originally Posted by bois

...

This is a brilliant post.

Note: Can we not argue about class balance here? Please show some restraint or go to one of the other 10 threads where that's already going on.

[Raindance]

Sure if you still have a problem Scias or anyone, just PM me.

And thanks anonymous Red Karma giver, I never played a lock, I simply gathered my own opinion based on playing other classes against Warlocks.

[PT_DaAr_PT]

Originally Posted by Raindance

I don't know... please point out where I've mispelled anything in my post. Seems to me you have more errors than I supposedly have.

Please don't make fun of the biased idiot who is too lazy to cite the source of the quotes and then fucks up to who he is replying to.

[NotScias]

Originally Posted by Raindance

...

I don't know where you've seen somewhere that I said warlocks are underpowered or that they need SM or whatsoever; I was just responding to Hidra's statement (as for the mispelling stuff) about locks being close to a god-mode class, which is far to be the case of course, althrought besides the Spell damage remaining fixed from level 37, Wind Wall and some bugs I think locks are pretty okay at the time being, things which the biaised idiot has listed in his first post....
I'm sorry for the red karma but that's not mine.

[Seher]

Originally Posted by HidraA

Yes wtf is in your mind.....but you forgot one thing hunters have camo...
Camo +confuse before any marks can buff + SS=hunter with armor and marks with his half of armor.

Camo + confuse = lame, boring and still useless in fort wars.

Originally Posted by HidraA

Maybe hunter is not so powerfull in dmg or defense ...but has this option...to disable any kind of defense or dmg bufs for any kind of class.

A lame and boring option. Plus this option just exists in PvP, in RvR it's useless.

Hunters are worse than marksmen, in any aspect. There's not a single thing hunters can do better than marksmen in RvR fights. (Stalker is not related to actually fighting, it's rather a preparation)

Originally Posted by Castingbeast

classes balanced W/O!!! any nerf, add new skills and spells by deleting useless ones (just make a poll for it) to compensate spells that were proclaimed as "OP"

That's impossible or at least way more work than just nerfing the overpowered stuff. What's so bad about nerfs anyway? It's the same in the end, whether you've buffed 5 classes or just nerfed 1...

Originally Posted by Raindance

I don't know why the f*ck you all cry for nerfs, then when they happen, quit because all NGD does is nerf, but really, complaining is the only good thing the English community can do nowadays. Seriously, there are much better ways to improve class balance instead of nerfing and swapping skills.

For sure, you know soo much about balance, more than every single MMO developer on this planet. Better ways to balance than nerfing stuff? Ridiculous.

[blood-raven]

To follow scais toughts, it would be better to give the evasion tree to the hunter and make another (ranged stuff) based one for marks.
A tree for say more ranged defence, more armour etc.

I have to support the "marks are the only thing between locks and there Opness"-statement, it's not the dmg locks can do (which they can) but there massive amount of cc's.
This problem is related to the current barb Opness or worse, once a lock catches you there is no way you can fight your way out (if you have at least an average skilled lock), with a barb you can have a fast freeze spell and gain distance but with a lock you just can't move.
Also i'm really troubled with the meteor vs BoW tought cause there is a thin line between one of those two to be the OP one. (Yes i know BoW is currently the one).

[maximus-decimus]

Old saves and no more new changes by NGD, they should let the game go, because any new idea ends up in a catastrophe.

As they finally brought us new forts, the (change i was waiting for soooo long) they destroyed it by this retarded bind system. Now unfortunatelly they dont take this bind system back, although every newbie sees on his first sight that this is killing RvR on lower populated servers, but who cares about the rest if the RA money gets right in to NGD.

A Balance between classes is way to hard to achieve for NGD, so just the binds back, maybe they are competent enough to achieve at least this.