Linux or Windows?

[andres81]

Originally Posted by kmdk

3.)Why this does not happens with DirectX ?

Because NGD is focussing on the DirectX code, they don't even recognize when the OpenGL mode of their engine fails so I guess this is just autogenerated and never tested.

[NotScias]

Originally Posted by DuoMaxwell

I say the switch isn't much more painful then switching form 98SE to XP, XP to Vista or from Win7 to Win8. No matter what the OS, even revisions of the same OS you will have problems. Those moves had tons of driver problems, often times ones that would never be fixed or could never be fixed.

Yes but the difference is that actually manufacturers do care much more about Windows and rarely about Linux. So drivers are available really shortly after or even before a new Windows release. Same for most of programs.
On Linux we had to wait for years until most of wifi drivers were finally stable and usable (remember the ndiswrapper shit era ?)...

Configuration of the Opensource Gallium3D drivers for AMD/ATI or Nvidia on Ubuntu was as hard as adding the Xorg-Edgers "crack-pushers" PPA off Launchpad to Synaptic > running Synaptic and picking the Edgers repo from the origins list, hitting select all and apply.

This may be trivial for you, or me, but that's something unknown for a long-time Windows-only user. That's what I'm talking about : this requires learning, time, reading many wikis, having already initied-friends nearby, etc... Not needed when you switch from a Windows to another Windows.
Also, xorg-edgers is a bleeding edge unstable repository. So that user could just get dropped in front of the TTY after the next update. Not really newbie friendly...

Never hear of Mate, LXDE, XFCE, Trinity? They all get the job done without sacraficing any much or any functionality. Just because the distro has decided to use a craptacular DE like Unity, Plasma Active or Gnome-Shell doens't mean you can't swap it out in under 5 mins for something that is lean and mean requiring no more then a logout. Not even a reboot.

Same as above. Trivial for already-initied Linux users but Windows-only users the concept of a Window manager or Desktop Environment is totally new and unknown.

Remember I'm not talking about people that are building computers since their kindergarten and already ran a dozen of different OSes, but about someone that seemingly never heard of Linux before and got someone that told him "Come to Linux your game will run twice as fast you will have no viruses and it's so much better and requires no learning."
I'm a long time Linux user and all for it, I am happy to see people interested in it and wish the market share will grow, but I can't bear the propaganda from the tux-evangelists that say that Linux is perfect and switching on it is as easy as double clicking Install on a LiveCD.
I just want them to be sure to know where they are going, the learning efforts they might have to do that may not be worth it if it's only about one program.

[DuoMaxwell]

You two claim to be Linux users yet are actively chasing someone away from trying it.

I'm not evangelizing I'm just stating the facts. I even warned early on about hardware compatibility and never once mentioned viruses.

I take it you guys have never set up a Windows computer thoguh, having to track down all of the drivers and software you need scattered over dozens of sites, ensuring that you have completely removed any trace of the old drivers or crapware installed by the OEMs just so you can get a system you won't have to baby half as much?

Driver update? Better hope you are on the mailing list as the new version may have come out months ago that has fixes for whatever games you are looking to play because nothing has a centralized updating system.

As for OS X, Apple's OpenGL stack is actually missing many features as they are building it themselves and up untill the death of Steve Jobs at the very least the company had absolutly no desire to add anything or tweak for gaming performance. I know, I remember the days where Aliens VS Predator 2 on my dual 800Mhz Quicksilver PowerMac with a vBIOS flashed x86 FireGL card to a Mac X800XL got litterally HALF the framerate as the equivilent hardware on Windows. Sure I could edit photos faster and edit nad transcode video faster then I could on Mandrake Linux or Windows XP at the time but gaming was strangely much slower then you'd expect.

So yeah, after moving at least 30 people in person to Linux over the years, having to do little more then tell them what software is equivilent to it's Windows counterpart and teaching them how to install software from the repos and putting the forum and IRC chats in their favorites I've have very few complaints.

[DuoMaxwell]

Originally Posted by kmdk

Before,long time a go when i was beginer in linux was cool to compile vga drivers,to compile thinks around and make them work faster and better.
Now i hate them ,i have no time to waste with compile and fix thinks around,i like box delivered think such as rpm or deb.

Who the hell compiles their own drivers? I just add the repo like a normal Linux user, not some sadistic Gentoo user. http://www.ubuntuupdates.org/ppa/xor...?dist=precise#

Simple 10 second step by step copy and paste instructions then fire up Synaptic and install updates galore.

[Tigerious]

Originally Posted by DuoMaxwell

[...]not some sadistic Gentoo user[...]

At least Gentoo don't have tainted & dirty kernel.

[DuoMaxwell]

Originally Posted by Tigerious

At least Gentoo don't have tainted & dirty kernel.

And if you cared so much you wouldn't even be here since this is propritary software and to even play most games you have to use the patent encumbered S3TC since most of the time S2TC just doesn't cut it.

Crawl back into your basement and spend a week recompiling Libre Office to shave a tenth of a second off it's loading time...

[NotScias]

I take it you guys have never set up a Windows computer thoguh, having to track down all of the drivers and software you need scattered over dozens of sites, ensuring that you have completely removed any trace of the old drivers or crapware installed by the OEMs just so you can get a system you won't have to baby half as much?

Again the fact that Linux is more or less difficult to use is not the point. I'd even say the noadays mainstream distros are even simpler than Windows. The problem is that the OP like most of people have spent most of their computing life using Windows, learnt on Windows, so no matter how simple is the distro it's still a big change, breaking old habits and compatibility with most of Windows apps.

So yeah, after moving at least 30 people in person to Linux over the years, having to do little more then tell them what software is equivilent to it's Windows counterpart and teaching them how to install software from the repos and putting the forum and IRC chats in their favorites I've have very few complaints.

Originally Posted by DuoMaxwell

You two claim to be Linux users yet are actively chasing someone away from trying it.

No. I'm just trying to bring some light and objectivity, because there's 2 points that are totally absurd to me here :
- Installing a whole different (heavy) OS just for the sake of one (crossplatform) game that might or might not perform better anyways,
I repeat : Do you realise we advice someone to waste at least 15GB of disk space, install a whole different OS and a bootloader just for one fucking game that already runs natively on Windows and with absolutely no guarantee it will even run better ? Really ??!
- Giving no hint. Like if it was a routine. As easy as installing a normal program that requires no learning and with no downsides.

We just don't know enough about this person. Is him a hardcore gamer playing all the latest mainstream games ? Is him the only one using this computer ? Is him using a lot of Windows-only programs that have no counterpart in the Linux world ? Is him willing to learn new things, prepared to break some habits or he just doesn't care and wants things to work™ just like they do now ? etc...
In a lot of cases, Linux won't have any benefit for a person besides wasted time, space and additional headaches. I really much prefer (and did) make prepared and willing people discover and switch to Linux rather than blindly promote it and enforce it to every people that runs into a small issue not justifying switching to another OS.

Okay this costs nothing to run the LiveCD and try it, but please not only for the sake of one game, there must be some will or real interest behind at least...

And if you cared so much you wouldn't even be here since this is propritary software and to even play most games you have to use the patent encumbered S3TC since most of the time S2TC just doesn't cut it.

Crawl back into your basement and spend a week recompiling Libre Office to shave a tenth of a second off it's loading time...

Haha you made my day !

[Hollow-Ichigo]

Originally Posted by DuoMaxwell

Crawl back into your basement and spend a week recompiling Libre Office to shave a tenth of a second off it's loading time...

u fucking legend

[DuoMaxwell]

You do know that if you don't like it you can always just, yah know, make a GParted Live CD so you can resize the Linux partiton down to around 2Mb, giving all that space back to the Windows NTFS filesystem and reinstall the Windows Master Boot Record?

That and he was looking to buy a new box, 15Gb out of a 1-3Tb HDD, since thats what is cheap these days, with the size jumping up 500Gb every $5-10 in that size range is absolutly insignifigant.

You have any idea how much porn you'd have to download just to fill 1Tb, let alone 3Tb?

Education is a life long process, if the guy is willing to learn I'm willing to teach.

[Seher]

Originally Posted by Shining-Scias

(remember the ndiswrapper shit era ?)

Wait, that era is actually over? (haven’t used wlan in a long long time)

Originally Posted by DuoMaxwell

So yeah, after moving at least 30 people in person to Linux over the years, having to do little more then tell them what software is equivilent to it's Windows counterpart and teaching them how to install software from the repos and putting the forum and IRC chats in their favorites I've have very few complaints.

Not only that, I really do think that a distribution like Ubuntu is FAR better for brain dead users than Windows. You can say what you want about that new software center (well, is new at all? haven’t used ubuntu myself in a long long time, and I only know synaptic ) but it’s really easy to use and self explanatory.
I know many users who can’t install software on windows. Or who can but shouldn’t. Oh how many borked windows PCs I have seen… Something like Ubuntu is way better for them.

Originally Posted by Shining-Scias

The problem is that the OP like most of people have spent most of their computing life using Windows, learnt on Windows, so no matter how simple is the distro it's still a big change, breaking old habits and compatibility with most of Windows apps.

Well, yes, although the change really isn’t that much of a bother.
But while the OP might have learned Windows, I just assume that he’s a nerd like us, and linux is better for nerds, too. :P Not that you have to use Gentoo or Arch, but getting the window manager you want and testing a few different ones out is quite satisfactory. And what’s with that hideous Windows task bar anyway? (Yes I hate KDE, too :3)
I fell in love with e17, by the way.

As a gamer you’ll sadly still need Windows, yes. But in the era of SSDs, come on! Rebooting to the other system takes just some seconds. My Arch boots in about 3 seconds, lol! Never before have I noticed just how FUCKING LONG the bios takes.
I use Linux whenever possible, just to tell it the sites I’m surfing, same for steam when it’s ready. I even bother with wine, I just seem to have the worst luck ever there. When games finally run I still have to switch to Windows because the performance sucks (SCII .___.)