[Question to NGD] Any recent statement on Warmaster powers?

[_Enio_]

Originally Posted by isaacrulzrs2

Some people would like to see the removal of the chance factor in its entirety, but that wouldn't work.

How many layers of resists do you want?

Do you really want to go thru the whole discussion why a general resist chance of this magnitude is a bad thing?

I actually really dont care about a replacement at the moment. Sure a proper solution would be nice but is of no importance compared to the destruction to tactical play off. beacons pose right now.

[NotScias]

I also agree that pure removal is not a solution at all. Many people worked hard to get lvl60 and the required coins to be WM.
Like it has been said, the idea was nice but the implementation is horrible.

Anyways I have already made my suggestion on it, but looks like NGD's happy with what's now...

[Psynocide]

Originally Posted by _Enio_

How many layers of resists do you want?

Do you really want to go thru the whole discussion why a general resist chance of this magnitude is a bad thing?

I actually really dont care about a replacement at the moment. Sure a proper solution would be nice but is of no importance compared to the destruction to tactical play off. beacons pose right now.

It is bad, never denied it - hence why I suggested it being halved.

Although, "destruction" isn't entirely fair.
Gameplay has shifted too a more linear feel but tactics aren't quite so diminished as you're implying, only different.

[EMIN]

Originally Posted by Shining-Scias

I also agree that pure removal is not a solution at all. Many people worked hard to get lvl60 and the required coins to be WM.
Like it has been said, the idea was nice but the implementation is horrible.

Anyways I have already made my suggestion on it, but looks like NGD's happy with what's now...

I agree with you. It is way wrong to remove wm powers beacause some players gace alot of money and time to reach 60 and completing quests everyday in order to reach warmaster so it will be completely unfair. They can change warmaster powers a bit or create new..

[GIO879]

Hi all,

I agree with Enio, but in fact few points are killing the game

1 - Of course the warmaster attributes (more disbalance):
i use the defensive beacon only to teleport me fisgael to war zone
Only 1 save by realm make the game so borred and the half of the map is absoluty useless ( yeah on RA server too ) this beacons kills the prejudiciable spells ( freeze , confuse , stun, ambush ) and by this way the tactical part of the game

2 - The random chance inside the supposed inume's spells ( sotw , madness)
it s totally ridiculous when the guu rsist 2 spells with any reasons , and for you he successed to freeze (ambush, and many more) inside the SOTW
and this with 20 levels of difference, by this way a barb level 45 can kill 1 level 60 !!!!!
I know a lot of people who leaves the game only for this point (50 at least)

3 - The game is became too much expensive there is too much difference between a prenium item and normal item, for a bow the damages are X2
Peoples can't follow this point too, NGD developed habit to nerf and restore the damages or protection by prenium items few months later
Look at the arrows by exemple .... piercing for 1 year and by miracle we can found slashing and more i, the preniums, specialy now when the half of peoples got a piercing protection hahaha very funny ...
Premiums should help you in game XP, Mana , Life , clothes etc ... but not so much for damages, armors


4 - The new forts and castles are too hight and big for the castles unplayable for the archers , i never fight inside them just arround the forts and i never go for the castles , too far to big to .... I had never understood why they 'rent in the middle of each realms

5 - the new attibution of the armor points , the archers can't drop something at the superboss it s a real pleasure to hit at 25 evendim , torkul or dean spend 1000 arrows for 200 gold
During battle to hit the enemies at 25 to or less when they haves 5000- 8000 points of life ( with beacons or no)

6 - NGD says they listen us but all is already decided 6 month or 1 years ahead, If they want to success they should work with a little group of players (30-50) before to put the changes in game and listen the return of this little player's group, amun serves only for the bug and the startegy is already decided. I never saw NGD changed something about them plans (i play since 2007)
Where is FROSK when a player like ENIO or others says some constructive things ?

Listen, Learn, and Build

[Seher]

Originally Posted by isaacrulzrs2

Horn of the wind does not need fiddling with, it's already taken a nerf, any more would only demean the war master status value.

LOLOLO horn of the wind is overpowered and it will continue to fuck up balance, until NGD realizes that speed is one of the MOST IMPORTANT PARTS of ranged vs melee balance that should NOT be fiddled with! Giving SOME players an extra spell that gives more speed is a NO GO! One HELL of a no go!

Giving more damage etc. always just makes the players stronger, but giving them more speed means there IS a fight, or there is NONE.

[bois]

Interesting debate. I made my opinion on WarMasters a while back.

I am not interested in removal . All i am interested in is that for very special abilities there must be a constraint elsewhere.

The most obvious constraint would be to provide a power point sink to these spells (to induce scarcity and reduce cookie cutter builds).
The issue is that War master powers come with all the advantages and absolutely no constraints.

More speed, more health, more resistance, more strength or whatever primary attribute, no mana constraint, no power point constraint, no speed stacking constraint (as far as I know barring the cap), no resistance layer stacking constraint(as far as I know), very little cast time constraint. Added to all this, as time goes on, these powers become glutted in the game with those armies having powers having more and more advantage over an army with either less manpower and/or less warmaster capability. Because of this, bigger armies with more warmasters have few to no constraints on cooldown of powers either. They can simply chain them.
This is why I suggested my system where all Warmaster powers are on the same access level and you can only choose 2 or 3. This induces scarcity and compels players to carefully consider their choices. Separate it from the normal level 50 type progression.
This is only on the foundation level as the spells themselves would have to be modified too. Actually, modify the contra indications for using them or actually add some.

Of course, they should have only either given 1 power point per level past 50 or give no power points at all if they wanted to press on with the system they ended up with. Giving discipline points was enough. Compel scarcity in builds again. Bring thinking back and compel diversity of builds through scarcity.
Yes, yes, they have to make all spells useful. That is for another thread.



There were so many conceptual mistakes in the whole update I really wonder it it can be patched at all.

[Psynocide]

Originally Posted by Seher

LOLOLO horn of the wind is overpowered and it will continue to fuck up balance, until NGD realizes that speed is one of the MOST IMPORTANT PARTS of ranged vs melee balance that should NOT be fiddled with! Giving SOME players an extra spell that gives more speed is a NO GO! One HELL of a no go!

Giving more damage etc. always just makes the players stronger, but giving them more speed means there IS a fight, or there is NONE.

There's not even a hint of a plausible argument here, just groundless opinion stating.

[_Enio_]

Originally Posted by bois

The most obvious constraint would be to provide a power point sink to these spells (to induce scarcity and reduce cookie cutter builds).
The issue is that War master powers come with all the advantages and absolutely no constraints.

Im not sure if makin it a PP sink would change alot. You would eventually see less WM uptime which could make it worse for gameplay experience as fighting WM as non WM is even more frustrating then both sides WMd.

My build would become really boring, id probably just dump most cc blocked by beacons. Example compared to this would be rather boring to play.

[Seher]

There is, you just don't get it. Let me help you out there:

Originally Posted by Seher

Giving more damage etc. always just makes the players stronger, but giving them more speed means there IS a fight, or there is NONE.

A good ranged vs melee system involves both running and fighting. Are you with me there? I hope so. This means warriors should reach their ranged enemies (soon), but at the same time the ranged ones should still be able to get away (a bit). That's an insecure balance, even if implemented well, because the ranged classes need to be similarly fast as the melee ones for this to work out well. Now guess what happens when one side somehow gets a HUGE and LONG LASTING (!!) speed boost. Yeah, right, the ranged class lacks the moments of distance it needs to stand a chance, or there even is no fight because the melee class doesn't ever reach the enemy.

Originally Posted by bois

There were so many conceptual mistakes in the whole update I really wonder it it can be patched at all.

That's basically what I think, too. You COULD do nice things with Warmasters, such a system doesn't need to be bad per se, but in order to make this one work you have to change nearly EVERYTHING, and it wouldn't go by without players raging about it, as you take something away from them that has been rightfully theirs, they "worked" for it.