Changes to the combat system - Page 7

Comp · 09-12-2009, 02:32 PM

My only fear is the same that Saint talked about.

Example: As a hunter there are many warriors where I only do 80 damage to and even less at times. So...with these changes I'll do considerable less damage? Whoa.

Also....will arrow prices reduce DRASTICALLY with the increased attack speed for archers? They are already stupid expensive.

ArchmagusArcana · 09-12-2009, 03:03 PM

As far as the movement canceling a spell thing, I think imob would be far preferable. Either way, im happy about it, but it will take a lot more adjustment to have to guess just how long the spell animation will take to complete (and likely overcompensate and stand still too long).

I am thrilled about that piggyback fix, seriously, though its going to make grinding my hunter a bitch.

To all you archers, im not trying to be a dick, but now you know what us warriors have been going through the last few updates, area nerf, ons nerf (the signature spell that almost every single barb had), we had to completely change the way we played to deal with all of these massive changes to our class. I sincerely wish you the best of luck adapting to these changes. It will be hard, no doubt about it, but i think that after the FINAL VERSION of these changes hit the live server, im sure its going to make the game better for everyone.

As for arrow cost, i see it getting even more out of hand than it is. My proposal: A quiver that you wear, infinite arrows, but with durability linked to the bow. It will still incur the same repair costs as other players get (more or less), but not be so retardedly expensive, so some balance can be maintained and these poor archers dont need to grind their faces off or beg for money to be able to war.

To NGD: Please please please give us ample time to test and give you feedback on the changes. Yes, they are massive changes, and for the most part it seems most people like them, myself included, but we need to have a fair amount of time to test then and see what really works and what maybe not so much. Just my two cents on that matter.

Dannboy · 09-12-2009, 04:14 PM

Remember, real men cant multitask. Therefore they cant cast and move at the same time. These chages are great ^^
And since Syrtis is full of Archers I look forward to see them stand still.

UmarilsStillHere · 09-12-2009, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dannboy

Remember, real men cant multitask. Therefore they cant cast and move at the same time. These chages are great ^^
And since Syrtis is full of Archers I look forward to see them stand still.

I look forward to them all starting warriors so we can get some class number balance for a change.

King_Of_Angmar · 09-12-2009, 04:24 PM

To me this is reason to play my hunter again, who has been boring for me to get on for so long as killing is relatively easy. Thank you for the challenge (an im not being at all sarcastic here).

The only thing that really worries me is that if i do even less damage then im not going to be hitting much harder than 20 damage per hit :P and i like to play ninja at times so without a pet my damage wont be worth crap :\ As far as i see, this is almost forcing hunters to play with pets.

Klutu · 09-12-2009, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Umaril

I look forward to them all starting warriors so we can get some class number balance for a change.

Syrtis Mass Warriors!!

/me gets Ready for Revenge <3

Saryad · 09-12-2009, 05:46 PM

I suppose i shall just have to start playing my conju as main if archers are going to be forced to hit like pussies.
Even NGD i doubt will find a need to 'balance' heals and dispel.

w_larsen · 09-12-2009, 05:52 PM

i have proposal - reduce moving speed to 25% while attacking with ranged. it would avoid frustration about need of being totally still and reduce possibility to basically escape while firing.

edit: or something like this, as you can't plainly reduce moving speed.

R_of_WWT · 09-12-2009, 06:08 PM

With archers shooting more arrows they will need to drop in price considerably. Otherwise ill just have to change classes its already expensive to play a marksman. Ide also like passive or semi passive spells that buff attack range to affect spell range it makes no logical since that we can shoot farther and not a spell with it. Otherwise marksman's choice of spells that can keep up with his range is getting quiet small to chose from ... soon ill just have to use a short bow assassin build and ide rather not have to do that.

Vaylos · 09-12-2009, 07:14 PM

I am thoroughly enjoying these changes. Every last one of them. I like the global cooldown/readiness of skills being independent of whether or not a normal shot is ready or not. (I hope I understood that right) Having skills/spells independent of your weapon being ready makes combat a LOT more dynamic.

I still think strafing needs to be the same speed as backpedal though.

As for moving canceling your shots, that should be normal, unless you're moving REALLY slowly, or within about 5 meter range. Because honestly if you're dancing around with a bow and arrow, and your target is also moving around, you're not going to hit anything at any kind of range. So this change is common sense to me. I think only melee should be able to move and attack. Possibly mages too, since I wouldn't think a mage "aims" the same way an archer does hehe.

However, if moving around cancels any kind of skill casts, I don't think that should throw the skill into cooldown since you're (either willingly or unwillingly) moving. By moving you've interrupted the skill/spell action, which means you haven't used the skill yet. I look at it like this: clicking the button and going through the cast time/animation is like priming the skill for use, and then after that ends and the skill is fired off, it goes into cooldown. Moving would cancel the priming, so the spell/skill was never triggered, so there should be no cooldown.

Still, we hunters (and marks too) are going to need to rethink our playing styles and choose our skills more carefully. I mean that in a good way though. I think we're going to be using our debuffs and controlling skills a whole lot more now. (or a whole lot more escapist/sotw whichever lol)

Anyway good work NGD, can't wait to see how things work out. And thanks again for explaining the issues with the host/client syncing. Hopefully the new method will work well, and hammer in the final nail on that old problem. It sounds like it will.

09-12-2009, 02:32 PM	#61
Comp Count Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Jippy's Mom's House Posts: 1,286	My only fear is the same that Saint talked about. Example: As a hunter there are many warriors where I only do 80 damage to and even less at times. So...with these changes I'll do considerable less damage? Whoa. Also....will arrow prices reduce DRASTICALLY with the increased attack speed for archers? They are already stupid expensive. __________________ Compost (60 Hunter) Alsius Compoundious (Dead and gone...)

09-12-2009, 03:03 PM	#62
ArchmagusArcana Master Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 357	As far as the movement canceling a spell thing, I think imob would be far preferable. Either way, im happy about it, but it will take a lot more adjustment to have to guess just how long the spell animation will take to complete (and likely overcompensate and stand still too long). I am thrilled about that piggyback fix, seriously, though its going to make grinding my hunter a bitch. To all you archers, im not trying to be a dick, but now you know what us warriors have been going through the last few updates, area nerf, ons nerf (the signature spell that almost every single barb had), we had to completely change the way we played to deal with all of these massive changes to our class. I sincerely wish you the best of luck adapting to these changes. It will be hard, no doubt about it, but i think that after the FINAL VERSION of these changes hit the live server, im sure its going to make the game better for everyone. As for arrow cost, i see it getting even more out of hand than it is. My proposal: A quiver that you wear, infinite arrows, but with durability linked to the bow. It will still incur the same repair costs as other players get (more or less), but not be so retardedly expensive, so some balance can be maintained and these poor archers dont need to grind their faces off or beg for money to be able to war. To NGD: Please please please give us ample time to test and give you feedback on the changes. Yes, they are massive changes, and for the most part it seems most people like them, myself included, but we need to have a fair amount of time to test then and see what really works and what maybe not so much. Just my two cents on that matter. __________________ Alsirian Legion Horus: Wulfgar Heartsfang 50 barb: Arcan Heartsfang 50 Lock RA: Drakonklenok 50 Knight

09-12-2009, 04:14 PM	#63
Dannboy Initiate Join Date: May 2008 Location: With DB on the top of Mount Doom were Sauron lives. Posts: 206	Remember, real men cant multitask. Therefore they cant cast and move at the same time. These chages are great ^^ And since Syrtis is full of Archers I look forward to see them stand still. __________________ Dannboy, Horus Knight lv 50 Ignis After two years The Cake Is A Lie _But there's no sense crying over every mistake. We just keep on trying till we run out of cake.

09-12-2009, 05:46 PM	#67
Saryad Initiate Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Birmingham UK Posts: 199	I suppose i shall just have to start playing my conju as main if archers are going to be forced to hit like pussies. Even NGD i doubt will find a need to 'balance' heals and dispel. __________________ Saint Saryad

09-12-2009, 06:08 PM	#69
R_of_WWT Pledge Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 15	Will need cheaper arrows With archers shooting more arrows they will need to drop in price considerably. Otherwise ill just have to change classes its already expensive to play a marksman. Ide also like passive or semi passive spells that buff attack range to affect spell range it makes no logical since that we can shoot farther and not a spell with it. Otherwise marksman's choice of spells that can keep up with his range is getting quiet small to chose from ... soon ill just have to use a short bow assassin build and ide rather not have to do that. __________________ R - WWT-

09-12-2009, 04:24 PM	#65
King_Of_Angmar Banned Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Wherever lag has Teleported me Posts: 99	To me this is reason to play my hunter again, who has been boring for me to get on for so long as killing is relatively easy. Thank you for the challenge (an im not being at all sarcastic here). The only thing that really worries me is that if i do even less damage then im not going to be hitting much harder than 20 damage per hit :P and i like to play ninja at times so without a pet my damage wont be worth crap :\ As far as i see, this is almost forcing hunters to play with pets.

09-12-2009, 05:52 PM	#68
w_larsen Initiate Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 111	i have proposal - reduce moving speed to 25% while attacking with ranged. it would avoid frustration about need of being totally still and reduce possibility to basically escape while firing. edit: or something like this, as you can't plainly reduce moving speed.

09-12-2009, 07:14 PM	#70
Vaylos Banned Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Coralville, IA Posts: 202	I am thoroughly enjoying these changes. Every last one of them. I like the global cooldown/readiness of skills being independent of whether or not a normal shot is ready or not. (I hope I understood that right) Having skills/spells independent of your weapon being ready makes combat a LOT more dynamic. I still think strafing needs to be the same speed as backpedal though. As for moving canceling your shots, that should be normal, unless you're moving REALLY slowly, or within about 5 meter range. Because honestly if you're dancing around with a bow and arrow, and your target is also moving around, you're not going to hit anything at any kind of range. So this change is common sense to me. I think only melee should be able to move and attack. Possibly mages too, since I wouldn't think a mage "aims" the same way an archer does hehe. However, if moving around cancels any kind of skill casts, I don't think that should throw the skill into cooldown since you're (either willingly or unwillingly) moving. By moving you've interrupted the skill/spell action, which means you haven't used the skill yet. I look at it like this: clicking the button and going through the cast time/animation is like priming the skill for use, and then after that ends and the skill is fired off, it goes into cooldown. Moving would cancel the priming, so the spell/skill was never triggered, so there should be no cooldown. Still, we hunters (and marks too) are going to need to rethink our playing styles and choose our skills more carefully. I mean that in a good way though. I think we're going to be using our debuffs and controlling skills a whole lot more now. (or a whole lot more escapist/sotw whichever lol) Anyway good work NGD, can't wait to see how things work out. And thanks again for explaining the issues with the host/client syncing. Hopefully the new method will work well, and hammer in the final nail on that old problem. It sounds like it will.