Reverted back on Spell casting?!?!?!?!?!

[ByteMe]

Ok, I've noticed that people are again able to move out of range of a warriors spells again. Was this in the change log or one of those things they just "slipped" in on us. This gimps the non-ranged classes once again!

Here's the complaint and why I had to turn the game off today:
Feint my fasting casting spell to stop and enemy has a casting time of .5 seconds and now hunters are simply running throughme and get the out of range message. Now my rib breaker and other spells are even more useless.

Any one else feel like this hurt the non-ranged classes again?

[misaccc]

i cant cast a normal shield bash on mages cuz they make a step backwards.......its sooo lame

[mrclean]

Ok, I've noticed that people are again able to move out of range of a warriors spells again. Was this in the change log or one of those things they just "slipped" in on us. This gimps the non-ranged classes once again!

Here's the complaint and why I had to turn the game off today:
Feint my fasting casting spell to stop and enemy has a casting time of .5 seconds and now hunters are simply running throughme and get the out of range message. Now my rib breaker and other spells are even more useless.

Any one else feel like this hurt the non-ranged classes again?

Sadly is so... I'm experiencing same issues. Too bad, this game is "archers-only".

[fluffy_muffin]

Sadly is so... I'm experiencing same issues. Too bad, this game is "archers-only".
LOL
i will whine every time when warrior will try to be at my back! Yes my ambush doesn't work if you are at my back. Yes i loose my stuning fist this way. So do not whine! archers only d'oh

[misaccc]

LOL
i will whine every time when warrior will try to be at my back! Yes my ambush doesn't work if you are at my back. Yes i loose my stuning fist this way. So do not whine! archers only d'oh

not whining...biut every1 can kill us by walking backwards now

[Angelwinged_Devil]

not whining...biut every1 can kill us by valking bakwards now
it's the same thing with mages, spell gets canceled when the target moves behind our backs or gets out of range, welcome to the real world and the nubcakes who says it's not a bug

[misaccc]

u habe range awd

[Angelwinged_Devil]

u havbe rangee awd
people are still able to move out of it, and it's pretty annoying if it's some =>1m cooldown spell.
and they are able to run behind us too, harder with metabolic control on but still possible.

[ByteMe]

The issue is I can't attack until I'm on top of you while I take a pounding just trying to get close. So for 30m you get to hit me for free to only have you run through my feint and run another 30m away.

This is making it even more difficult for non-ranged classes again.

[ByteMe]

people are still able to move out of it, and it's pretty annoying if it's some =>1m cooldown spell.
and they are able to run behind us too, harder with metabolic control on but still possible.

Much harder to get of 30m range vs. 0m range... The point is that this has changed within the last few days and nothing was mentioned abouit it. Where's the changelog? What about comments from the balance team?

[magnet]

The changelog says that you can't escape *instant* spells (that was the bug). As you said, Feint has a 0.5s casting time, so that's the time to escape, you have to balestra before but click when you are sure the guy is in range or going towards you, don't "precast" it because if you do it will cast as soon as he's in range and thus it's easier to evade... :p I don't know if I'm understandable =).

[wakim42]

The changelog says that you can't escape *instant* spells (that was the bug). As you said, Feint has a 0.5s casting time, so that's the time to escape, you have to balestra before but click when you are sure the guy is in range or going towards you, don't "precast" it because if you do it will cast as soon as he's in range and thus it's easier to evade... :p I don't know if I'm understandable =).

the problem is exactly that i get out of range with balestra too. I agree non-instant spells are meant to be evaded by moving BUT its a bug for instant ones.

EDIT: and feint is instant, not 0.5 second casting time

[fluffy_muffin]

not whining...biut every1 can kill us by valking bakwards now
Us? Yes i allso can die when someone i walking back or moving behind object while casting. So it is problem for archer and warrior. But hell yeah this game is archers only ¬¬

[asetas]

Yeah I know this little bug and I have been using it with my hunter. And I agree with DF about that "Archers only game" because most of the players are archers and if you aren't archer .. well you are pretty much doomed. Mage Vs. Archer; archer just runs away from distance of spell when mage is casting and voilã. We have cream supplied mage on ground waiting for the final blow.
Exactly same thing happens againts warriors. Just few steps back and start rolling on floor and shooting randomly what every you find from hotbar and warrior is dead.
I will really stop playing this game if I don't see improvements fast such as:
-Less lag
-Other ways to make money such as; Fishing.
-Something actually usefull to premium.. We got horse but you know..
-If you have money troubles.. get banners and sponsors.

[makarios68]

Too bad, this game is "archers-only".

I don't think so.

My marks is now lvl 47 and sometimes still gets 4, 5, or 6 misses in a row - on mobs and enemies.

Also, archers can have their spells cancelled if enemies go behind them.

[Angelwinged_Devil]

how many archers are on the balance team :p?

[ncvr]

how many archers are on the balance team :p?
Well there's Joel, and there's Thanus.
Besides, it's not an archers only game. Knights can make a pet useless and a marksman will have difficulty killing a knight due to high hp and defense.

[mann2411]

i think that every classes spells that when the casting time comes up should be cast no matter if the person takes a step back or runs out of range or hides behind a wall or anything at herbred today i wasted more spells because people wouldnt stand still than i got hit

[ncvr]

i think that every classes spells that when the casting time comes up should be cast no matter if the person takes a step back or runs out of range or hides behind a wall or anything at herbred today i wasted more spells because people wouldnt stand still than i got hit
If that was implemented us warlocks would be nearly impossible for certain classes that rely on dodging our spells.

[misaccc]

If that was implemented us warlocks would be nearly impossible for certain classes that rely on dodging our spells.

agreed...but imo warrior spells shouldnt be able to be dodged by walking backwards

[ncvr]

OMG you hit 1000 posts! congratz man! :D

Anyway...

I think it's fine that way other than the ones without a cast time. Just lower the cast time for South Cross and Ripost to maybe 0.5s.

[NightTwix]

you shouldnt be able to walk out of an instant spell.
The new spellcasting system introduced some wierd bugs. It takes some time to even them out

I've seen people get knocked down and when they were back up they appeared 20m in front as if they never were knocked.

stuff like that...

[Angelwinged_Devil]

If that was implemented us warlocks would be nearly impossible for certain classes that rely on dodging our spells.
I think this is a good idea, you shouldn't be able to cancel any spell by walking behind them or out of range while casting to cancel it

[DemonMonger]

you shouldnt be able to walk out of an instant spell.
The new spellcasting system introduced some wierd bugs. It takes some time to even them out

I've seen people get knocked down and when they were back up they appeared 20m in front as if they never were knocked.

stuff like that...
this is the thing... even if a spell says instant... it the instant spell is not your first attack, you will have weapons speed figured into your second third and so on attacks..... if your weapons speed is very slow and your first attack was not the instant... when you use the instant in a combo and not as first attack it will always have drag and never be instant....

example

basic hit + instant = instant attack is instant
basic hit + balestra + instant = instant cannot be cast until the duration of very low weapon cooldown time ends 1-1.5 seconds

ive been watching my enemies in battle... and i noticed this too... if they use any attack that is not an instant and then try to follow up with the instant... its very easy to dodge them ... also I dont like that warriors basic attack makes them slow down.... Even though they can run and hit... I feel warriors should be able to run full speed and hit without movement penalties...

[Boger]

Some bugs:
Instant spells like balestra/feint get wasted most of the time while casting them in the run.
Going out of range of a warrior is not hard, so the canceling shit is annoying.
Sometimes when you or some1 else uses a "Cannot Move" spell, then the character is visually in one spot, but he is (seen by the server) like 5m away, which makes it hard to hit him, because you are physically 5m away from him, not like you see it, close to him.

[misaccc]

wha feint aint instant bog...

[mann2411]

actually if they wont make what i suggested leave it most warriors cheat anyway they run up attack and whenever it looks like your chargin up your attack they run behind you a lost spell it means that a lvl 11 warrior can beat a lvl 50 archer if they just keep doing it its happened to me i've been beaten by some unchallenging person cause he exploits this the least bit we should be able to turn while charging

[ncvr]

actually if they wont make what i suggested leave it most warriors cheat anyway they run up attack and whenever it looks like your chargin up your attack they run behind you a lost spell it means that a lvl 11 warrior can beat a lvl 50 archer if they just keep doing it its happened to me i've been beaten by some unchallenging person cause he exploits this the least bit we should be able to turn while charging
That is a commonly used tactic. And all classes have a counter for it.

[misaccc]

actually if they wont make what i suggested leave it most warriors cheat anyway they run up attack and whenever it looks like your chargin up your attack they run behind you a lost spell it means that a lvl 11 warrior can beat a lvl 50 archer if they just keep doing it its happened to me i've been beaten by some unchallenging person cause he exploits this the least bit we should be able to turn while charging

half of the spell u cast on him will hit him...so no way he can beat u

[Angelwinged_Devil]

That is a commonly used tactic. And all classes have a counter for it.
one thing is being behind a person to make him "not able to face the enemy" another thing is to cancel the spells by going behind him as he is casting a spell, this is a bug

[ncvr]

one thing is being behind a person to make him "not able to face the enemy" another thing is to cancel the spells by going behind him as he is casting a spell, this is a bug
No, it's not a bug and the tactic is fine.

GoS has used it on me...DMC has, lots of Ignis hunters have.

[Angelwinged_Devil]

No, it's not a bug and the tactic is fine.

GoS has used it on me...DMC has, lots of Ignis hunters have.
it's a bug, and you shouldn't be able to cancel a spell this way, you can already dodge/resist a spell and that's enough, what is in the game mechanics.

[misaccc]

i dont dodge when i run into some1s back...the spell just goes through the mages back and hits me:p

[Boger]

wha feint aint instant bog...

Wtf are you talking about... Feint is instant... it doesnt have any cast time...

[misaccc]

Wtf are you talking about... Feint is instant... it doesnt have any cast time...

i have a cast
wtf now i see no casting time...this is nuts im gonna try it out
edit:meh must be the lag

[Boger]

i have a cast:(
wtf now i see no casting time...this is nuts im gonna try it out

I have really no comments about this... -.-

You always try to be smarter, but you see how always it turns out for you :P

[DemonMonger]

one thing is being behind a person to make him "not able to face the enemy" another thing is to cancel the spells by going behind him as he is casting a spell, this is a bug
going behind while u cast is not a bug... its tactical evasion... and only works if you move out of range before casting time ends..

The same spell fails happen to me if i cast tear apart and you move behind me... it wont hit you..
or ensnare.. or ambush.. or all my other spells... if you want a decent counter... power up blaze,crystal blast, or mind push...

I am asking surakor about this issue now.. to see if he says its skill/tactics or a bug...

[Angelwinged_Devil]

going behind while u cast is not a bug... its tactical evasion... and only works if you move out of range before casting time ends..

The same spell fails happen to me if i cast tear apart and you move behind me... it wont hit you..
or ensnare.. or ambush.. or all my other spells... if you want a decent counter... power up blaze,crystal blast, or mind push...

I am asking surakor about this issue now.. to see if he says its skill/tactics or a bug...
if they wanted people to evade this way they wouldn't code in an evasion function...

and that sucks when it happens yes with those spells too, it should be implented for all classes, whne you start on a spell/power you end it, even if you move out of range or behind, then the evasion system should determine if the power/spell hits or not.

edit: oh btw can you tell him to check his inbox, there's a pm waiting for him

[misaccc]

I have really no comments about this... -.-

You always try to be smarter, but you see how always it turns out for you :P

lol ill take a screen...today i tried feint on some goat i saw the cast bar but imidiatly disapiered...but hell i dunno maybe its just the evil lag

[ncvr]

if they wanted people to evade this way they wouldn't code in an evasion function...

and that sucks when it happens yes with those spells too, it should be implented for all classes, whne you start on a spell/power you end it, even if you move out of range or behind, then the evasion system should determine if the power/spell hits or not.

edit: oh btw can you tell him to check his inbox, there's a pm waiting for him
There used to be a *bug* for being able to cast on opponents behind you. But it was fixed. Why? Because it is a legitimate tactic.

[Valorius]

I do it all the time. If a hunter couldn't utilize this tactic, it would be literally impossible for a hunter to engage in close range combat with pretty much anyone...

[Angelwinged_Devil]

There used to be a *bug* for being able to cast on opponents behind you. But it was fixed. Why? Because it is a legitimate tactic.
there's a difference between casting on opponents behind your back and cancelling a spell by walking behind someone while he's casting. Read my post again and you won't find me saying that is not a legitimate tactice, because I use that one myself. But I try not to walk behind someone while he's in a casting stance

[DemonMonger]

There used to be a *bug* for being able to cast on opponents behind you. But it was fixed. Why? Because it is a legitimate tactic.
yep... :clapclap:

[DemonMonger]

one thing is being behind a person to make him "not able to face the enemy" another thing is to cancel the spells by going behind him as he is casting a spell, this is a bug
>.< whats this?

[daehenob]

AwD,

Moving past someone to dodge a spell is a tactic. Why? Because a spell requires concentration and effort (hence the casting time) and when a character is finished casting and there is no longer a target, the spell fails. (Whoops! Better luck next time.)

I am not familiar with warlock spells, but I bet that the spells that require a higher casting time are the spells that are more detrimental to and have a higher impact on the outcome of an encounter (ie, high damage or unwanted effects). First order of business when you meet an enemy should be their mobility*. As a warlock, you have several options for immobilizing them so I'll not list them. *Then* comes the damage. ;)

WRT not moving when you notice someone is casting a spell on you (unless it's an ally ;) ): that's just stupid. Why would you *not* try to dodge something that is going to hurt you (in a very bad way more often than not)? ;D

*: Actually, I'd personally place spell-casting above this. Silence ftw! :D

[mann2411]

this isnt just about warlocks and it just aint about awd. back to the general topic of warriors if the whole warriors thing is fixed it should be fixed for everyone cause as supprising as it sounds yer its fine when it happens to you but do you like the wasted spell and mana? if your a warlock do you like it when your target moves outta the way then suddenly the sultars terror spell is wasted? do you like only getting 2 rps for doing normal dmg? its all fine and good when you can do it but you dont seem to want it happening to you

[daehenob]

mann2411,

It's called "tactic" for a reason. From what I gather, AwD is mad because spells are not hitting because people are moving behind him. Well, he should change his tactic so this isn't a problem. ;)

And if a warlock is worried about wasting a terror because the target moved out of the way (either out of range or behind the casting warlock), then the warlock is *not* using the spell to it's full potential. It's an area spell for a reason, not meant to be used against solo targets.

And no, it isn't just about warlocks or AwD, but he seems to be raising quite a stink about it. And seeing as how AwD is, in fact, a warlock, makes it about warlocks *and* AwD. ;)

Back on-topic (if there ever was one :O ): I think what DMC said is true, that weapon speed factors in to when a spell will be cast (OMG, RLY?). If a warrior wants to feint/balestra/whatever someone, they should *not* rely on the hit/piggyback effect, ever. Cast the instant AS AN INSTANT and you should be fine. :)

[Angelwinged_Devil]

thank you for the personal attacks daehenob, how many times to I have to say that when I try to argue something it's not only from a warlocks point of view unless I say it is.


Moving past someone to dodge a spell is a tactic. Why? Because a spell requires concentration and effort (hence the casting time) and when a character is finished casting and there is no longer a target, the spell fails. (Whoops! Better luck next time.)

I think you are mixing real life and game mechanics together. As I said before there's a system for evading/blocking/resisting powers, you shouldn't be able to move behind someone and cancel their spell, or out of range.


I am not familiar with warlock spells, but I bet that the spells that require a higher casting time are the spells that are more detrimental to and have a higher impact on the outcome of an encounter (ie, high damage or unwanted effects). First order of business when you meet an enemy should be their mobility*. As a warlock, you have several options for immobilizing them so I'll not list them. *Then* comes the damage.

You shouldn't immobilize an enemy every twice a second, beside these spells can be canceled too by going behind them (mind push, will domain, prickling ivy) I'm quite familiar with my own class' spells and other classes spells too

you're treating me like a newbie, look at this post, do I mention only warlocks? No I don't This counts for all classes not just the warlock.
Besides there's a way of cancelling spells already, and that's dizzying/using some power which prevents certain spells.


>.< whats this?

if I'm behind you while you try to cast a spell you can't, and THAT is a tactic. When you go through a person to cancel his spell then it's a bug.

[daehenob]

AwD,

How is my replying to a post you made a "personal attack"? Who's the paranoid one now? ;)

And how is moving out of the way not "evading" a spell, game mechanics aside? What about the mechanics of just not being in the range of the spell? Casting time (and the visual indication) is there for a reason: GTFO. :D

Warlocks only? I mainly play a marks, and rest assured I am plagued by this "bug" just as much as you - or any melee class - are. ;) I don't know about you, but when *I* see a warlock go into the casting stance, I either run/charge/low-pro, depending on the situation. (I know low-pro isn't a warlock or even a mage spell, but this thread isn't just about warlocks. ;) )

[magnet]

As a Warlock and a player, I think going in the back of a caster to have him waste his spell is not only a proper tactic, it's also how we recognize a decent player (when done smartly). If Angelwinged Devil refuses himself to such "lowly acts", he's only giving his opponents an advantage.

This is most definitely not a bug, and using it is nothing more than taking advantage of the game mechanics, just like running out of range or behind a tree. There are also counter-measures to avoid wasting spells when your target goes in your back, especially for Warlocks.

[ncvr]

thank you for the personal attacks daehenob, how many times to I have to say that when I try to argue something it's not only from a warlocks point of view unless I say it is.


I think you are mixing real life and game mechanics together. As I said before there's a system for evading/blocking/resisting powers, you shouldn't be able to move behind someone and cancel their spell, or out of range.


You shouldn't immobilize an enemy every twice a second, beside these spells can be canceled too by going behind them (mind push, will domain, prickling ivy) I'm quite familiar with my own class' spells and other classes spells too

you're treating me like a newbie, look at this post, do I mention only warlocks? No I don't This counts for all classes not just the warlock.
Besides there's a way of cancelling spells already, and that's dizzying/using some power which prevents certain spells.


if I'm behind you while you try to cast a spell you can't, and THAT is a tactic. When you go through a person to cancel his spell then it's a bug.
Sorry if this sounds offensive, but you are using the same old arguement in all your posts AWD.

And brad, I am a warlock, and it doesn't bother me too much if somebody cancels my cast by using those tactics.

[Angelwinged_Devil]

Sorry if this sounds offensive, but you are using the same old arguement in all your posts AWD.

And brad, I am a warlock, and it doesn't bother me too much if somebody cancels my cast by using those tactics.
doesn't, but if the same argument answers something with a new input from someone else and it isn't thought out with my previous input I'll repeat myself if nescesary ;)


It's called "tactic" for a reason. From what I gather, AwD is mad because spells are not hitting because people are moving behind him. Well, he should change his tactic so this isn't a problem.


And no, it isn't just about warlocks or AwD, but he seems to be raising quite a stink about it. And seeing as how AwD is, in fact, a warlock, makes it about warlocks *and* AwD.

sorry, but I see this as a personal attack and not really an argument >_<, but that's out of the topic.

And how is moving out of the way not "evading" a spell, game mechanics aside? What about the mechanics of just not being in the range of the spell? Casting time (and the visual indication) is there for a reason: GTFO.

because it's not meant to cancel the spell as there's already a coded way of evading and cancelling a spell, that's dizzying while casting or using low profile as you suggested.
I once thought about how the code was set up, probably a bit like this just more abstract.

castspell()
{
If target is in front of person 180 degrees
initiate spellcasting
delay cast time
if target is in front of person 180 degrees
cast spell
}

I figured it was made because of the lag so you could not cast on people who are behind you.


Warlocks only? I mainly play a marks, and rest assured I am plagued by this "bug" just as much as you - or any melee class - are. I don't know about you, but when *I* see a warlock go into the casting stance, I either run/charge/low-pro, depending on the situation. (I know low-pro isn't a warlock or even a mage spell, but this thread isn't just about warlocks. )

I know you are plagued by that bug too, what you just said above is what I said in my previous post too, I'm not speaking warlock only unless I state I do it.
When I see an argument I usually presume that it's not an argument who is just pro players class but the general balance. I expect the same view upon my posts.
But that's just an opinion in the long run as if I see a post which looks like it's just pro one class or pro himself/herself I may see this but not reply as this.

You should use your spells and skills in a fort war and a pvp to evade spells and such, not move behind someone or out of range. It gives the word "team work" a much bigger meaning imo Since it would require someone else to cancel a potential warlock casting sultar, a barb wanting to do lightning strike or a marks casting lightning arrow by a dizzy spell if your own is in cooldown, it'll force you to say a name so your teammates know you spotted someone trying to bring down your army.

[ncvr]

doesn't, but if the same argument answers something with a new input from someone else and it isn't thought out with my previous input I'll repeat myself if nescesary ;)



sorry, but I see this as a personal attack and not really an argument >_<, but that's out of the topic.


because it's not meant to cancel the spell as there's already a coded way of evading and cancelling a spell, that's dizzying while casting or using low profile as you suggested.
I once thought about how the code was set up, probably a bit like this just more abstract.

castspell()
{
If target is in front of person 180 degrees
initiate spellcasting
delay cast time
if target is in front of person 180 degrees
cast spell
}

I figured it was made because of the lag so you could not cast on people who are behind you.


I know you are plagued by that bug too, what you just said above is what I said in my previous post too, I'm not speaking warlock only unless I state I do it.
When I see an argument I usually presume that it's not an argument who is just pro players class but the general balance. I expect the same view upon my posts.
But that's just an opinion in the long run as if I see a post which looks like it's just pro one class or pro himself/herself I may see this but not reply as this.

You should use your spells and skills in a fort war and a pvp to evade spells and such, not move behind someone or out of range. It gives the word "team work" a much bigger meaning imo Since it would require someone else to cancel a potential warlock casting sultar, a barb wanting to do lightning strike or a marks casting lightning arrow by a dizzy spell if your own is in cooldown, it'll force you to say a name so your teammates know you spotted someone trying to bring down your army.
The casting time for those spells is 1.5 - 3 seconds. Even with voicechat, it's impossible to react that fast when you're already focussing a certain target during a large fort war.

[magnet]

AwD, the thing is *you* want the game to behave differently because *you* think it's not meant as it is ; *we* think NGD meant it the way it is and considering it's been like this since Regnum was released and that everyone in the know (e.g: NGD & the balance team) considers it the proper behavior, it is *NOT* a bug.

So I understand you may not agree with the system in place, but you would be kind to stop calling it a bug and criticizing those using the tactic. It's not the first time you brought this up and yet you still speak the same.

[Angelwinged_Devil]

AwD, the thing is *you* want the game to behave differently because *you* think it's not meant as it is ; *we* think NGD meant it the way it is and considering it's been like this since Regnum was released and that everyone in the know (e.g: NGD & the balance team) considers it the proper behavior, it is *NOT* a bug.

So I understand you may not agree with the system in place, but you would be kind to stop calling it a bug and criticizing those using the tactic. It's not the first time you brought this up and yet you still speak the same.
it's a bug in my opinion and I'll keep calling it a bug sorry. I'm still not convinced until megrim or someone else says you're meant to be able to cancel a spell by running.
I will keep my opinion.
and I'm not critizising, I'm argumenting against.

[NightTwix]

i uses and still use this tactic of walking through the enemy
But i wouldnt mind if it gets changed. Its gray area in my eyes.

Walking through the enemy would still be a good tactic even if the current spell doesnt get canceled.
And didnt i read a posting from Megrim who said that the spells dont get canceled any more?

[Angelwinged_Devil]

i uses and still use this tactic of walking through the enemy
But i wouldnt mind if it gets changed. Its gray area in my eyes.

Walking through the enemy would still be a good tactic even if the current spell doesnt get canceled.
And didnt i read a posting from Megrim who said that the spells dont get canceled any more?
I heard that it was fixed too, but apparently it isn't :s, it's still possible to do but hard when you have arcane devotion active