Awesome Knights Defence #2

[Foggia]

Yay!
Afair Red Star made a topic where he complained about barb making him 2k dmg with sc. Here is smth better - lvl 41 pt barb (me :hat: ) hits lvl 50 knight for that:

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w282/Piccolo53/screenshot2008-04-1310_18_06.jpg

Who said knights are so hard to kill?

[misaccc]

ugh....was there a sudden SC damage increase?everyone started hitting 2k SC's
:o

[Pizdzius]

Czesc Foggia ;)

And so I still keep my thought that barbs with sc are overpowered. xD

[magnet]

I like the "he was a noob ^^" comment while it looks like you were 4 vs 1. Wonder who the noobs were :jacky_chun: :hat:

[Foggia]

I like the "he was a noob ^^" comment while it looks like you were 4 vs 1. Wonder who the noobs were :jacky_chun: :hat:


I didnt want to put this comment, but I noticed it after uploading screen ~~
And no, actually :hat: was attacked by 3 enemies, just found some friends :>

[Pelesz]

I didn't helped him, cant get in range within time. ^^ :bangin: or max 1 normal hit XD

[kraetyz]

Blergh. Why don't they change South Cross?!

[misaccc]

because its cool...i SC-ed Pretty to death today....got like 6 SC's 700-800dmg on her xD

[kraetyz]

because its cool...i SC-ed Pretty to death today....got like 6 SC's 700-800dmg on her xD

PT! :bounce:

[ncvr]

Blergh. Why don't they change South Cross?!
They will.

Just not yet...

[Static_Fang]

They will.

Just not yet...

I hope they never do, means barbs will be first priority and the warlocks can finally have a fking break!

[Pizdzius]

because its cool...i SC-ed Pretty to death today....got like 6 SC's 700-800dmg on her xD

SC with knights is super ok for me. But not on barbs.

[Static_Fang]

SC with knights is super ok for me. But not on barbs.

Barbs die A LOT MORE then knights, makes sence barbs HIT A LOT MORE than knights

[magnet]

Barbs die A LOT MORE then knights, makes sence barbs HIT A LOT MORE than knights

You have no idea of what you're talking about. Play warrior then we'll see. Barbs die faster, not more, but at least they can contribute to something in the fight, being faster, having better dmg resistance, way better hits, and good disciplines.

And those are hits on knights. Two barbs insta kill a knight, is that your definition of tank?

[ncvr]

Barbs die A LOT MORE then knights, makes sence barbs HIT A LOT MORE than knights
+17% resistence to all physical dmgs (weapon disciplines lvl 4)
+20% resistence to physical dmg (max Frenzy)
+70% armour (lvl 4 caution)

Results in:
~100 dmg from lvl 45ish hunters using longbows
60 dmg per tick from lightning (5)
15 dmg per tick from serpeant bite (5)

You seem to underestimate barb's defense.

[Signatus]

There are many things that the log doesn't show...

Was he buffed for dmg soaking? Was he hit by a SS? Or another unbuffing spell? Did you had Onslaugh + Berserk + Colossus + Dmg Amplifier + Str item boosts + whatever I can't remember...? Does your weapon have some magical dmg imbued? Of which type?...

I have been hit by some nasty SC myself... and a 1.7k typhoon... but no way you can deal that dmg on a buffed knight... at least on me... I hope.

[Foggia]

+17% resistence to all physical dmgs (weapon disciplines lvl 4)
+20% resistence to physical dmg (max Frenzy)
+70% armour (lvl 4 caution)

Results in:
~100 dmg from lvl 45ish hunters using longbows
60 dmg per tick from lightning (5)
15 dmg per tick from serpeant bite (5)

You seem to underestimate barb's defense.

Ye but to make such dmg u have to have berserker on urself which gives -100% protection and 0% evade chance :)
And 2nd thing: u cant make such dmg with putting 3 points to every physical dmg resistance in weap + caution + 4 to frenzy


And:
"Two barbs insta kill a knight, is that your definition of tank?"
Should be:
"Two extremely lucky barbs insta kill a knight, sacrificing pretty much of their def and mana, is that your definition of tank?" I wouldnt make screen and topic about that if this was a normal sc I make on every knight. Maybe he was unbuffed, there were 2 archers. And I had onsl + berserker + (maybe, cant remember) off with their heads.

[magnet]

Oh yes, yoshi, yes yes he can.

Yoseba did some crazy south crosses on Hector or me.

Yesterday I was with Xzor, watching over the healths.. Hector had 4/5th of life. By precaution I think "oh he's fighting Yoseba, better throw him a heal now" == full life. One sec later, he had one millimeter of life left.

I always use Caution, I don't have the slashing resist currently, but hey that's only 10% so it's easy to see how much it would deal (even at 17% or 20%).

Those hits are mad, and by mad I mean stupid mad. It makes no sense whatsoever...

Btw Maton did on my full buffed self a 1900 hp SC and afaik he's not skilled for mad damage like Yoseba is.

This spell has to be nerfed for barbs. I am for the removal of Ripost and South Cross, put those spells in Vanguard (so Knights choose the one they prefer- mid damage 100%, or low or high depending on chance). And let all barbs attacks be in the 2 hands mastery tree (Beast attack does just fine, Znurre did some 1.7k hits with it, that's enough -- and regular hits with TFB are enough too).

In my mind, when using mana a knight should reach a barb's regular hits, and when using mana a Barb should top every other hit... But they shouldn't be over 2k fully buffed, and certainly no more than 1.4k against a knight!

I discussed it with Blood and a good skill would be a passive resist +30% at lv 50 but only for attacks < 4m, so it would make Barbs manageable and Knights vs Knight is obviously fair (but longer, who cares).

I went in the arena the other day and fought Barbs, well I got badly raped because if you can't MindSquash Unstoppable + TFB + Frenzy + Berserk you're dead very fast. When I mindsquashed a lv 50 Barb and had the luck of blocking 90% of his skills I did rape him, but that happened just once.

[Static_Fang]

If a knight went with all defence moves, then i would consider it to be 'tank', for they would be almost impossible to damage...even if all they hit were low 1xx's, thats better than urs being blocked all the time.

And no, i meant more, barbs tend to be targeted more than knights

and yes, i have played both knight and barb high lvl

[magnet]

If a knight went with all defence moves, then i would consider it to be 'tank', for they would be almost impossible to damage...even if all they hit were low 1xx's, thats better than urs being blocked all the time.

And no, i meant more, barbs tend to be targeted more than knights

and yes, i have played both knight and barb high lvl

So Knights take hits but don't do anything, they just stand there? And you have a pretty big idea of blocking, I always have passive lv 5 + precise block lv 5 + shield with high blocking value and it really depends, sometimes I'll block all, sometimes nothing; and for that it's 140 mana/30 == my mana regen on peace stance.

Yes Barbs are targeted more but that's often also the Barbs fault, a lot of them run first instead of letting the Knight tank. And Obviously they are more targeted because they don't block and suck against elemental damage which ranged offensive classes can use easily (warlock's elements & marksmen's arcana strike/ignus scorch).

That doesn't make it fair for knights.

[Signatus]

+17% resistence to all physical dmgs (weapon disciplines lvl 4)
+20% resistence to physical dmg (max Frenzy)
+70% armour (lvl 4 caution)

Results in:
~100 dmg from lvl 45ish hunters using longbows
60 dmg per tick from lightning (5)
15 dmg per tick from serpeant bite (5)

You seem to underestimate barb's defense.

Yes, you can have all that but

- no deafening roar.

- no weapon area attacks (which means, "Wtf are you doing in the war without the fcking area? You lvl 50 noob!!!").

- no efficient SC (yes, might be my belief but that is only efficient at 5... unless you are a knight imho).

- not enough points to dmg spells after pumping the 3 passive resistances, and caution, and frenzy, and the rest of the "must have spells" on warcries.

It's a trade off, everything on this game is a trade off, you can specialize on something and rock at it at the expenses of not being efficient on other situations.

Btw, I would never tune a lvl 50 barb to have such configuration, you would live a bit more but the barb objective is to kill before being killed, not to endure until he kills his enemy (knights do it... sometimes) simply because, he can't do it (he's a primary target... an "overpowered" primary target)!

[Signatus]

Oh yes, yoshi, yes yes he can.

Yoseba did some crazy south crosses on Hector or me.

Yesterday I was with Xzor, watching over the healths.. Hector had 4/5th of life. By precaution I think "oh he's fighting Yoseba, better throw him a heal now" == full life. One sec later, he had one millimeter of life left.

I always use Caution, I don't have the slashing resist currently, but hey that's only 10% so it's easy to see how much it would deal (even at 17% or 20%).

Those hits are mad, and by mad I mean stupid mad. It makes no sense whatsoever...

Btw Maton did on my full buffed self a 1900 hp SC and afaik he's not skilled for mad damage like Yoseba is.

This spell has to be nerfed for barbs. I am for the removal of Ripost and South Cross, put those spells in Vanguard (so Knights choose the one they prefer- mid damage 100%, or low or high depending on chance). And let all barbs attacks be in the 2 hands mastery tree (Beast attack does just fine, Znurre did some 1.7k hits with it, that's enough -- and regular hits with TFB are enough too).

In my mind, when using mana a knight should reach a barb's regular hits, and when using mana a Barb should top every other hit... But they shouldn't be over 2k fully buffed, and certainly no more than 1.4k against a knight!

I discussed it with Blood and a good skill would be a passive resist +30% at lv 50 but only for attacks < 4m, so it would make Barbs manageable and Knights vs Knight is obviously fair (but longer, who cares).

I went in the arena the other day and fought Barbs, well I got badly raped because if you can't MindSquash Unstoppable + TFB + Frenzy + Berserk you're dead very fast. When I mindsquashed a lv 50 Barb and had the luck of blocking 90% of his skills I did rape him, but that happened just once.

Yoseba is... a good example why marksmen should be instructed since elementary school to take the barbs out! He tuned his barb to max fcking dmg at expenses of... everything else. His life saver is called Unstoppable Madness and if an "overpowered" marksmen targets him since he reaches weapon range to the moment he dies he won't do a thing (the problem is if there's a knight with deflecting barrier but...).

In my opinion no hit should ever be "limited". Players make choices, and those choices lead to strong points and weaker points. if Yoseba gives a lot of dmg just make sure he can't attack anyone until he dies...!

Besides, what is overpowered in Yoseba it's not "THE SOUTH CROSS"... it's his gear that raised his base dmg (then again...it was a choice...)!

I'm aware of fighting at the arena against an "unstoppable" barb... but I believe I have the tools, now I only have to learn how to use them (and gain some more lvls...).

[Znurre]

Znurre did some 1.7k hits with it

That's not 100% true.
When I used Beast Attack lvl 5 I could sometimes cause 1.6k dmg on mages.
Atm I am using lvl 4 Beast Attack, and I am lucky if I reach past 900 dmg on warriors.

Sometimes, with conju buffs, I can reach 1.2k dmg on mages.

[magnet]

Yoseba is... a good example why marksmen should be instructed since elementary school to take the barbs out! He tuned his barb to max fcking dmg at expenses of... everything else. His life saver is called Unstoppable Madness and if an "overpowered" marksmen targets him since he reaches weapon range to the moment he dies he won't do a thing (the problem is if there's a knight with deflecting barrier but...).

In my opinion no hit should ever be "limited". Players make choices, and those choices lead to strong points and weaker points. if Yoseba gives a lot of dmg just make sure he can't attack anyone until he dies...!

Besides, what is overpowered in Yoseba it's not "THE SOUTH CROSS"... it's his gear that raised his base dmg (then again...it was a choice...)!

I'm aware of fighting at the arena against an "unstoppable" barb... but I believe I have the tools, now I only have to learn how to use them (and gain some more lvls...).

With my Marks I target and killed Yoseba a few times.. But what happens most of the time? Deflecting Barrier blocks everything. Combine it with Unstoppable madness... And a Conjurer behind. This makes no sense to have an "invulnerable" combo..

About the "tools" against an unstoppable Barb, good luck. I use Disable limb, Mind squasher lv 5, and those tools work only if you're lucky. In 4 fights I used Mind squasher 2 or 3 times with no success. If you're planning on using brain piercing of something like that, even more good luck :p. Btw as I stated I beat some Barbs too, including Yoseba in an 1 on 1 fight near merca pinos, it can happen but it's a matter of luck, which sucks. I already hit shit compared to them, and I damage a Barb less than a Knight...

Anyway I think those spells in the hand of barbs are overpowered, I got my Mages instakilled quite some times, what's the challenge? Only reach your target? Well before the new Unstoppable Madness it might have been difficult but now it's not.

@Znurre: nvm then, but you don't use berserk afaik and you must keep in mind the damage barbs such as Yoseba will manage to do...

[Znurre]

Yoseba is not using Unstoppable Madness.
I always manage to knock him.

The problem is that AoO, Berserk and Unstoppable Madness got the same animation...

[magnet]

Yoseba is not using Unstoppable Madness.
I always manage to knock him.

The problem is that AoO, Berserk and Unstoppable Madness got the same animation...

At war, he is sometimes -- I can't balestra/knock him down. It depends, I guess sometimes it's on cooldown :).