Why multirealming is bad

[Kitsuni]

Pardon the thread title. :)

Over time I've spoke to many multirealmers, and the large majority that I have known do not realize that they are doing anything wrong by multirealming. They have absolutely no concept of how it harms the game, and believe that they are only having fun by playing the most active realm at any given time. So I've made a little list of reasons why it is harmful, to help educate those who do not quite understand the issues that it presents.

1) Multirealmers tend to join the winning side, not the losing side.
They just want to have fun, afterall, its a game. But this tilts an already unwinnable batle further in the favor of the enemy. In many cases, this can make a critical difference, now that the game has moved from holding multiple forts for a set period of time, to holding only one fort at a time. This makes it easy for just a few more players to heavily influence the outcome.

2) Multirealmers tend to switch sides to kill the noble during invasion.
Who can honestly resist all those warmaster coins? Its not uncommon for people to switch to the winning realm to get noble kills. The problem here is that the invading realm almost always tends to have the advantage, due to how the game is designed, in a way that gives all advantages to the realm that is already advantaged (positive feedback loops). Again, this puts the losing realm at a further disadvantage, not having that player to help defend.

3) Multirealmers cannot be realistically trusted.
Someone who plays multiple realms is a logical intelligence risk and cannot be trusted not to share information. Many people see this as minor; what harm could something like telilng the other realm what fort is going to be attacked? Until a force of only five people get there to find it camped by ten enemies. Those who I have known over the years see this as "creating action", but in reality, its an action-killer, because it tilts balance to the defensive side.

4) It is hard to consider a multirealmer to be an ally.
Many chose not to support multis because they have a tendancy to switch whenever it is convenient for them, not when it is convenient for the realm. This can lead to things like getting killed by a friend and then switching to kill them in return. It creates mistrust between players.

In short... multirealming does have a significant effect on the game. In the old days, it wasn't as common as it was now, as there were no boosts and grinding a char in another realm was very difficult. Now with the introduction of boosts, more premium items, merged accounts, etc. it has become much more common, with many players thinking its just way to enjoy the game better, without realizing that they are making the game worse for everyone else, including their own friends.

I realize that realm pride doesn't mean anything to some people, but it is a very nice concept that can help your realm overcome the odds.

[Gabburtjuh]

I multirealmed (even perma changed) to the at that moment underpop realm, and alot of people did exactly thesame as I noticed while talking to other grinders.

Multirealming, even though I dont like it either, doesnt hurt balance that bad, its just that the total playerbase for the english server sucks. That's all I'm gonna bother saying about it.

[Cuchulainn]

Pardon the thread title. :)

Over time I've spoke to many multirealmers, and the large majority that I have known do not realize that they are doing anything wrong by multirealming. They have absolutely no concept of how it harms the game, and believe that they are only having fun by playing the most active realm at any given time. So I've made a little list of reasons why it is harmful, to help educate those who do not quite understand the issues that it presents.

[...]

the statements from the points 1) and 2) would be more convincing, if you could give us a list of these multirealmers who prefer to play in the overpopulated realm.

I personally prefer to help those in the underpopulated realm (I'm not a very active player though). My chars in Ignis Cuchulainn, Lamfada; in Alsius: Fenric, Alwin, in Syrtis: Parzival (Raven) who was almost never on after the merge, and since a few weeks when Syrtis started to become underpopulated Adalwin.

IMHO multirealming in not necessarily bad in general. It just depends on how it is done.

[VandaMan]

I know of more who multirealm to join the underpopulated realm, although I admit this could be just a result of them being less ashamed to admit it in that case xD

[Carn]

Multirealming isn't bad, people are.

[Groark]

I completely agree with Kitsuni. Multirealming destroys the game.
There are even more reasons why multirealming sucks but the most important are the ones Kitsuni wrote. Problem is: what to do about it?
As I understand multirealming is continuosly switching from one realm to another for your own benefit. Switching for a large period of time I dont consider multirealming.

[Rising_Cold]

There are just so many types of multirealming
overall i think that the only once bad are when they switch to get noble, to win a war or to give intel

some people are multies to play at the underpop realm
others to chat to people from other realms
to explore the ini zones and quests the other realms have

I do agree that the multies who go to the winning side, switch to get noble or tell to which fort ppl are going
are bad for the game (and defenitly for the losing/underpop/defending realm)

[Checkit]

This thread is stupid. Virtually all, if not all, of the points OP stated are completely false and/or have no/very little facts/statistics to back them up. Just because you think this crap doesn't mean everyone else does, or that it is true.

[Kitsuni]

By the way ,this thread isn't to rustle anyone's feathers, just to get people thinking a bit.

Multirealming, even though I dont like it either, doesnt hurt balance that bad, its just that the total playerbase for the english server sucks. That's all I'm gonna bother saying about it.
I can agree with this point. Some of it has alot to do with population, although I have encountered this problem on RA too.

Multirealming isn't bad, people are.
I don't honestly think that everyone is innately bad or selfish. However if someone is tempted they will be more likely to partake.

the statements from the points 1) and 2) would be more convincing, if you could give us a list of these multirealmers who prefer to play in the overpopulated realm.

I personally prefer to help those in the underpopulated realm (I'm not a very active player though). My chars in Ignis Cuchulainn, Lamfada; in Alsius: Fenric, Alwin, in Syrtis: Parzival (Raven) who was almost never on after the merge, and since a few weeks when Syrtis started to become underpopulated Adalwin.

IMHO multirealming in not necessarily bad in general. It just depends on how it is done.
I actually agree with your points, and I didn't intend to be "convincing", merely "informational". I still think that the majority of multirealming is done simply for the enjoyment of the game, and that those people do not truely understand its effects, as i outlined in the original post.

I know of more who multirealm to join the underpopulated realm, although I admit this could be just a result of them being less ashamed to admit it in that case xD
I think that this truely used to be the case. But lately I see many more cases of people who just want to have fun/win/etc. I wonder why?

It can't simply be the introduction of Steam, as that was too recent.

There are even more reasons why multirealming sucks but the most important are the ones Kitsuni wrote. Problem is: what to do about it?
As I understand multirealming is continuosly switching from one realm to another for your own benefit. Switching for a large period of time I dont consider multirealming.
What to do about it? Well, NGD could provide positive incentives to stick to a single realm, or to help the underpopulated realm(s).

[Aries202]

I don't mind it, the way this game works there's always one dominating realm.

What I despise is people who log in the other realm to sabotage what the realm is trying to do. Hint Aquaboxio Hint.

When I left to Alsius it was because of a new server, I don't think I could change realms just because Ignis is in the bottom of the food chain.

Some other people leave a realm just because they're fed up of their current realm.

In reality there's only a handful of people that change realms that do an impact and it only shows at night, sometimes realm A has 30 people than realm A loses 20 people and realm B magically has 20 more people.

[bois]

I beg to differ. Multirealming is not a great thing but, it is not as bad as people make it out to be either in and of itself. Multi realming combined with a group of other factors, makes things appear bad.

Population , or rather lack thereof is a serious problem especially on Haven. We simply do not have enough to withstand even minor fluctuation in players.
Let us not even talk about multi realming, just a simple thing like players logging off to get some sleep could tip the balance. This has always been a problem, it still is.
Multi realming simply puts the spotlight on the root problem which is chronically low population.

The rest of the items are a bit subjective. There are many people that can probably attest to both sides of the discussion and without some hard data this is just here-say.

But let us assume (ass-u-me) that this is generally correct. The post will not help much because rightly put, players go where the fun is.
Therefore, logically speaking, the game lacks enough fun in one place to convince a fair amount of people to stay loyal? Am I right?

So far I see no solutions . The reality is this. The game does not have any end content or extension worthwhile of holding players to a realm. You get 60, then you get 5 more for each class then you get RP then invade , kill a few super bosses then what ? You want to play but there is simply nothing left. So you go somewhere else to start it all over again.

NGD is not hurting, in fact they may be extending their revenue stream by actually allowing players to have 18 characters without adding one iota of content (6 for each realm). So their motivation to do anything is zero.

So this opening post, while informative, is still merely a fluff piece that provides no solutions, no roadmap or even reaches the majority of the player base who probably never reads the forum anyway.

The solutions must start at viable, reusable content for spending time in one realm. Expansions should mean new real estate to explore, harder bosses, and achievements that are difficult to attain but gives the ones who get it , fame and notoriety. This is why I suggested a while back that the achievement system could be used as a tool .
In addition to that, in my thoughts on warmasters, they should have added a trait system , contingent on acts of war or other PvE tasks to get them.

That way, NGD could have stretched the content like a rubber band, have a modular platform to add stuff one by one and at the same time, reduce the need to multi realm. In fact , it would have been an outright disincentive because if you played jack -of-all-realms, you would be left behind. You would have had to specialise to be the best. And, it would have been fair because you could not easily buy your way to the top. You had to go out there and put in some sweat equity.

Regards

[Kyrottimus]

I agree with Artec. The crux of the problem is population imbalance (or simply lack of population), no matter how you slice it.

I've been both on the underpopulated and overpopulated side of war in RO. And while the overpopulated side of it can be fun (for the first 10 minutes) it gets old fast and gets really tiresome as well.

I would submit to anyone who cared that there have been a myriad of ideas and concepts over the years here in the suggestions sub-forum (both via gameplay mechanics and through incentivization) that could help keep war fresh and relatively balanced for all realms involved.

This would require some creative programming, involving a system that automatically adjusts to even the odds.

Think of it this way, before the relic invasion system was implemented, the defending realm would have a certain number of NPC guards spawned as a "balancing" countermeasure vs. the number of invading realm players. This was useless, however, as first the NPC guards were woefully ineffective and second could be bypassed by the invading realm all logging off before the yellow timer turned to the orange timer and logging back in after.

Now it's reversed, the invading realm gaining a gate-camping dragon. Reversing the implied intent of balancing things out.

While it certainly adds a new dynamic to invasions (along with capturable gates), it does not address the issue.

My point with all this is that if there were some mechanism to enact some self-scaling game mechanics to counter drastic population imbalance, I think the type of multi-realmers that Kitsunie is referencing would find no more "benefit" to pick the winning side if the playing field were somehow leveled. Even if we're talking of only 10-12 people here.

It's not an easy task, I'm just saying I don't have a problem with multirealming if done under the right circumstances. Removing all the wrong reasons for someone to multirealm via scalable game mechanics would be an elegant sollution (however not an easy one, as again would take some very creative brainstorming and coding).

[Krungle]

There is a difference between switching realms and even making a toon to explore another realm's inner. There was a green hunter in Goat inner the other day who seemed to be too familiar with the topography not to have a toon at least at some point that had a blue pigmentation. IMHO, that is perfectly okay, all of that.

However, when someone is carrying a Relic and logs out or hands a gem to another realm, then that is far from ok. As Aries pointed out, I too have seen this and it is bad to see. If people were to play one realm only in RvR then multirealming can be ignored but when people switch realms to counter the balance, either for or against any other realm, that is bad.

I have not posted anything in my post I have not seen with my own eyes. These things happen all the time and are immoral.

[bois]

Hard you say Kyro?

If you had an achievement that logged your time (server side) and every X amount of time (where X is a large number) you logged on a toon, you received 50 Xim, would that work ?

It is terribly crude but could be super effective . LOL.

The relic issue : jut make it so that only level 60's or warmasters can carry gems or relics. (I don't think it is serious enough to make things that drastic yet though)

[Krungle]

The relic issue : jut make it so that only level 60's or warmasters can carry gems or relics. (I don't think it is serious enough to make things that drastic yet though)

It was 60's that I have seen that handed over relics/gems. How would this resolve anything, especially if the realm has a Knight shortage at the time of a three-relic pickup?

[Hollow-Ichigo]

It was 60's that I have seen that handed over relics/gems. How would this resolve anything, especially if the realm has a Knight shortage at the time of a three-relic pickup?

Always give the relic to hunters.

[Rising_Cold]

Always give the relic to hunters.

psst pene.. over here yes, now shh its a secret but.. goats have no hunters sshh!

--
tbh I hvnt seen multies logging on other chars to sabotage wars in a while..
I do remember the picking up gems and running around so the wish couldnt be made
or enemies could easily grab it..
but yeah hvnt seen that in a while now (am I missing something? :o )

[Raghn]

would be good if NGD provide some hash id when install RO client.. like a hash from mac address..

soooo player log in ignis.. ok.. insert that hash id and link realm..

if he want switch to alsius or syrtis in other account, he cant... some time restriction.. idk, 24h/12h/6h/4h/2h ?

or player change mac address and reinstall, or play in other computer... (just change mac address dont help multirealmer, cause that hash id already generated)

is not perfect, but help a bit prevent opportunist multirealmer, like switch realm to kill noble, or just annoying ppl login other realm just to spam chat...

[Chrysalis]

To those of you arguing that multirealming isn't bad if you switch to underpopulated realm, or depending on how it's done, etc, you are wrong. You are completely forgetting that this is supposed to be a RvRvR game. No matter if you switch to join the winning side, or switch to join the losing side, it is still wrong. What about the third realm?

The design of this game is supposed to be three realms. If one realm attacks another realm, you shouldn't leave to join the attackers OR the defenders. You should stay with your realm! The third realm is then supposed to act to either help the attacker, help the defender, or help themselves (go for relics, gems, nobles).

I agree with the OP that multirealming, in all cases, ruins this game. I don't know how many times I've seen my friends list evaporate when our realm is losing, or another realm is being attacked. And just as suddenly, when the attack is over, here comes a bunch of players back. Multirealming converts this from a 3-dimensional RvRvR game to a BORING two-dimensional (and mostly one-sided) RvR game. If you guys want an RvR game, you may as well quit and go play WoW. If not, stop the multirealming!

Unfortunately, NGD can't enforce this (as discussed many times elsewhere). We have to rely on human decency from the older multi-realmed players. I'm always left disappointed in that.

[AxisVirtd]

or player change mac address and reinstall, or play in other computer... (just change mac address dont help multirealmer, cause that hash id already generated)

Man, two copies of the game for two different users, using different-eth adapters will solve this problem easily.

[bois]

It cannot be enforced but at the same time, there is no disincentive to it either.

I reiterate that the genesis of multi realming comes from the fact that there is an abrupt lack of end content. Combine this with the fact that the levelling curve is not incredibly difficult ( some will not agree with this) and that NGD, in its attempts to gather revenue, actually encourage this. Right now, the more cash you have the easier it is to multi realm and with a lot of level 60s.

This is where the free component comes in. There must be enough disincentive to multi realm.
Realm loyalty bonuses is the way to go. Some bait with minor sums of Ximerin or even premium item. Others reward with exclusive exotic items that do not impact gameplay. For example, clothing, dances, emotes etc.
In other cases, there are rewards for loyalty which improve your character. These would come in the form of traits. These are hard to get and require time (and not money) to acquire.

Even special things like a special island players can get to (with a special boss that drops special things) but only after they made the time based achievements to get there. Obviously this time will not be a low number and not take into consideration the time they already spent in game on a specific realm. Obviously, they will have to keep clocking some time (more loyalty) to keep going back. Your ticket to the special place is realm loyalty.

Calling on people's moral compass will not work. Never has, never will. The only thing that works is the carrot on the stick approach.

With all this said, unless NGD finds alternate and better revenue than boosters, horses and lucky boxes (all revenue enhanced by multirealming) these ideas I write will never see the light of day.

Regards.

[Raghn]

Man, two copies of the game for two different users, using different-eth adapters will solve this problem easily.

man was just a example to think.. not a cookbook :p

but can do something like that to get hd serial

on c++ using system(hdparm -i /dev/sda | grep -i serial) on linux.. (u can use dual boot / diff user doesnt matter... the hash id is the same)

well it's not my job. i dont work on ngd ;)

[ieti]

I think multi realming should be possible if not abused. I myself switched realms, and of course kept my syrtis account. After all i played a lot there and it will be a waste to delete characters and gear. I just have no heart to delete my old conjus which i love.

Still i noticed a strange trend several times. For example Syrtis got a big population boost at times they invaded at daily basis. Alot new high level players just popped in and started to play. When this madness finished same players just vanished.

I still think a nice solution to multirealming will be the mercenary idea. You can go in other realm for a period of time and if you wish stay there. Of Course this switches are restricted. I played other games where there was a market instance which was possible to be entered from every realm. Was very popular and nice to see trade and talk with different people.

[Krungle]

Last night when Ignis got the last Relic a bunch of my realm disappeared. It wasn't that Ignis needed more players to carry of a successful invasion but it did make defending against it impossible.

[learntoplay]

I log into other realms sometimes to hunt with friends there. I'm originally from Ignis (ra), and Moved to Alsius (raven), then when the servers merged (Horus + Raven) I was a multi \o/

I must admit I rarely play for a realm, I play for my friends - I'll hunt with my friends. I don't invade with Ignis or Syrtis though, if i'm on Ignis or Syrtis I don't take part in invasion process at all :P

I think this is how most people do it.. they just log in to other realms to play with their friends there for a short period of time.

[MxCx]

Last night when Ignis got the last Relic a bunch of my realm disappeared. It wasn't that Ignis needed more players to carry of a successful invasion but it did make defending against it impossible.

I was hoping more people would post in this thread after everything that was said in realm chat. I don't know how you people can still argue that multirealming isn't a bad thing. Where do you think a lot of the alsius night crew came from up until the last two weeks? Where do you think they went? That's pretty easy to answer. It's obvious that whatever realm the multi's move to becomes the dominant realm, it's completely upset the balance of the realms in the game. You want to say it's normal ebb and flow of players...bullcrap...the population is too low here, and there aren't enough new players joining the warzone to create a problem like this.
It's the people that are loyal to their realm that suffer, they are the ones left behind to try to defend their realm and deal with the problems this creates.

What should NGD do? Whatever it takes or whatever they can. They should ban their multi accounts, and not give them back afterward like they did with known cheaters.

[erttzzadfk]

I love switching to the winner side all the time.
Hope they'll never make an ip- and hardware-id-based-timer to avoid switching realms..or an anticheat like this to make bans usefull..
And finally i love legal multiaccs most <3
*ironic? maybe...maybe not. Who cares*

[VandaMan]

Where do you think a lot of the alsius night crew came from up until the last two weeks? Where do you think they went? That's pretty easy to answer. It's obvious that whatever realm the multi's move to becomes the dominant realm, it's completely upset the balance of the realms in the game. You want to say it's normal ebb and flow of players...bullcrap...the population is too low here, and there aren't enough new players joining the warzone to create a problem like this.

I think the answer is actually quite a bit more obvious than that. You seem to be convinced that multirealmers randomly switching realms determines which realm is dominant, yet the problem being discussed is that multirealmers are moving to the dominant realm. That argument is a bit circular, don't you think? If multirealmers move to join the dominant realm, then multirealmers aren't the cause of shifting dominance, they're an effect.

You, and players like you, have come to these conclusions as a result of:
-taking this game way too seriously
-taking your realm way too seriously
-being sore losers

The real reason your Alsius night crew had a surge in activity, and then a reversal of fortunes is that people play to have fun. Winning is more fun than losing. If Alsius starts doing well, your players stay on longer, they war more, and when they log off for the night they're more likely to come back the next night. That's what happens when you enjoy yourself. Similarly, if Alsius starts doing poorly the opposite happens. It really is that simple, and has little or nothing to do with multirealmers, let alone a massive zerg of them flip-flopping realms all at once to turn the tide of wars xD

[erttzzadfk]

I think the answer is actually quite a bit more obvious than that. You seem to be convinced that multirealmers randomly switching realms determines which realm is dominant, yet the problem being discussed is that multirealmers are moving to the dominant realm. That argument is a bit circular, don't you think? If multirealmers move to join the dominant realm, then multirealmers aren't the cause of shifting dominance, they're an effect.

You, and players like you, have come to these conclusions as a result of:
-taking this game way too seriously
-taking your realm way too seriously
-being sore losers

The real reason your Alsius night crew had a surge in activity, and then a reversal of fortunes is that people play to have fun. Winning is more fun than losing. If Alsius starts doing well, your players stay on longer, they war more, and when they log off for the night they're more likely to come back the next night. That's what happens when you enjoy yourself. Similarly, if Alsius starts doing poorly the opposite happens. It really is that simple, and has little or nothing to do with multirealmers, let alone a massive zerg of them flip-flopping realms all at once to turn the tide of wars xD
Totally agree. Helps me to go on switching to the dominant side..dominant a bit or much more...who cares? Great post. Tyvm

[VandaMan]

Totally agree. Helps me to go on switching to the dominant side..dominant a bit or much more...who cares? Great post. Tyvm

http://i491.photobucket.com/albums/rr271/zeme111/gianttroll2-.png

It's odd though, I've mostly noticed you switching to the losing side :p

[erttzzadfk]

Oh, sry. Did i post pictures?
However; keep this game ugly. You're the man.

[VandaMan]

Oh, sry. Did i post pictures?
However; keep this game ugly. You're the man.

I have no idea what you're talking about xD

I merely meant that you're intentionally trying to piss people off, by saying you're a multirealmer and always join the winning side, even though in truth you do the exact opposite. I'm pretty sure that's textbook trolling, and you should be ashamed, or something.

[erttzzadfk]

Thread still open? wtf
There is nothing you can do against multirealmers. (ip + hardwareID..)
Let's all switch to the winner side.
It's just a game - let's all have fun :)
*cya - nothing left to say.

I merely meant that you're intentionally trying to piss people off, by saying you're a multirealmer and always join the winning side, even though in truth you do the exact opposite. I'm pretty sure that's textbook trolling, and you should be ashamed, or something.
Kidding me? lol - ppl use to call me a traitor where ever i am.

[errei]

cmon aqua, ignis invaded 3 or 4 times... i agree that one side winning all the time is bad. but was like 3 days, and already is over... but doing such a kid thing u did is worse than joinning a winning side. IMO

[erttzzadfk]

- Make 3 characters. One at every realm. (call them "Alsius Stats", "Ignis Stats", "Syrtis Stats" or smth like that..)
- Add every single player you see to your friendlist for one week. (Dont use characters you use to play. +700 at friendlist cause lags..).
- log on two of these characters at the same time, when you think an invasion will be started (invaded realm / invading realm).
- watch your friendlists (how many really switch to defend and how many switch to attack the easy way)

...and then try again here.
*kids like to play games... so call me a kid if you like to do. That's ok at a game-forum.

[bois]

Why would NGD do anything? More characters more potential $$$ especially if those players want to fast track them .

But then, 10 or 15 players moving around can only matter if the population is terribly low. If the server was near pop cap, would this minority even be an issue?

Besides, multirealming only really matters during invasions. Invasions has its own flaws which has little to do with multi realming . Like low population, multi realming simply casts a spotlight on those invasion flaws.

It is an issue, but not as bad as some are making it out to be. At least by itself. It is simply a magnifying glass for other issues.

[Hollow-Ichigo]

Haven should merge with Nemon/Piranha. Job Done. Now close this bs thread.

[Linuxmage]

Haven should merge with Nemon/Piranha. Job Done. Now close this bs thread.

Refine that slightly -- Kill off Haven, Kill off Nemon, Merge all nemon players to Valhalla, and merge all EU haven players to Valhalla as well. Then, merge all US haven players to Pirahna. Job done.

[Hollow-Ichigo]

Refine that slightly -- Kill off Haven, Kill off Nemon, Merge all nemon players to Valhalla, and merge all EU haven players to Valhalla as well. Then, merge all US haven players to Pirahna. Job done.

Yeah but EU and US haven players are good friends, i couldnt live with not seeing my ignis fam again D:

[Aries202]

Refine that slightly -- Kill off Haven, Kill off Nemon, Merge all nemon players to Valhalla, and merge all EU haven players to Valhalla as well. Then, merge all US haven players to Pirahna. Job done.

Half my clan is European, most of the people I party with are European.

I wish you a painful death you monster, you. :D

[Rising_Cold]

Refine that slightly -- Kill off Haven, Kill off Nemon, Merge all nemon players to Valhalla, and merge all EU haven players to Valhalla as well. Then, merge all US haven players to Pirahna. Job done.

comon Stark.. what would happen to poor me if I didnt have a chance to see
Icy, jesse, fry (insert more names which i otherwise might forget here) and tania
online again :huh:

Even if you got lots of friends having something stupid as a server 'merge' take away a few is always..
(well dunno if its the right word but...) painfull

you cant split up our (mostly) awesome community like that
let them complain about timezones..NGD made an international server
if they split it up now they will lose the 'older' players, coz most play for the community

[Lebeau]

Time zone considerations CAN'T be the primary focus for merge options, can they? ... Haven split east & west? ... East goes to Valhalla (Gamego's German Troll Paradise) & west goes into Piranha (Brazil's Fishy Festivale Server)? We might all be online together at same time maybe, but too bad we won't be able to meaningfully communicate with many of our allies. FFS, I don't speak a word of portuguese & many there won't speak much english either. Linguistics matter more methinks.

+Cold & others truly got the right of it imho: as-is community is currently about the only thing holding most of these servers together & keeping them marginally profitable. If NGD's looking to essentially destroy it's existing longterm repeat customer base as well as it's CoR revenue stream, this would assuredly be one way to go about doing so....

Realistically, however, it's UNavoidable. There will be more server mergers (a la Horus/Raven) as time goes on & game winds down .... the current 5 will become 3 or 4 perhaps .... those will become 2 .... the 2 become 1 .... then lights out, party's over .... it IS the traditional mmorpg way-of-things, no?

[Imago-Thunderfist]

The great question is: will Regnum survive the release of a well-known MMO in the near future (mid-late 2013 or maybe early 2014)? Because what I did notice after the releae of GW II was less people, if that happens again...

[Groark]

The great question is: will Regnum survive the release of a well-known MMO in the near future (mid-late 2013 or maybe early 2014)? Because what I did notice after the releae of GW II was less people, if that happens again...

I think that what you mean is: will Haven survive? Regnum will certainly survive. You have only to play a bit in Ra server to see the massive great battles there. They have a big comunity. Haven on the contrary is desolated. Very sad to see how a server with such potential as Haven is going down.

[Linuxmage]

The great question is: will Regnum survive the release of a well-known MMO in the near future (mid-late 2013 or maybe early 2014)? Because what I did notice after the releae of GW II was less people, if that happens again...

It is worth noting that plenty of players that went off to have a go at GW2 did come back to us. I suspect the same will happen with TESO, and as it will not support Linux (which forms a considerable section of CoR's playerbase), we wont be losing any of them anytime soon.

Additionally, a sequel to DAoC is finally in the works, to be called Camelot Unchained. However, it is likely to be 2014/2015 before we even see a Beta.

I am personally of the opinion that unless NGD finds a considerable investor to throw at this game and does something to increase the quality of gameplay in CoR, it will shrink. However, as long as NGD exists, then CoR will go on.

A little bit of shrinkage I believe is inevitable -- Like I say, it will involve server merges, and how that will happen is hard to predict.

[Aries202]

I remember the early days of Ra, when it was still a small server coming out of Beta. There was a lot of friendly people. A lot of community events, GM's were involved. It just had a nice atmosphere, come out of work or school come home and hop onto a game which was fun because of the people.

Sadly, Haven isn't like this at all, there's many battles inside realms too many enemies not many friends. I don't think this server can ever come together and host a server wide tournament like other servers have done in the past. You will mostly see popular people, and by that I mean just familiar faces.

CoR on Haven isn't fun, and that's just the issue. We have too many selfish players and nasty players. People stay in their tight circle of friends and keep others out, anyone new will be frown upon. Then we have such terrible people with shit personalities.

I remember when I first tried Horus, the people there was just terrible. Maybe I was too used to Ra, too many friendly that blocked out the nasty. Here, Haven is covered with nasty, and you can barely see the bright light in it.

Ra is an international server just like Haven, at one point Ra was as small as Haven. If you want to fix a problem, you have to fix it internally. Not these suggestions of time zones and mixing of servers(having so many servers was already a bad idea).

That's just my two cents.

[Rising_Cold]

I remember the early days of Ra, when it was still a small server coming out of Beta. There was a lot of friendly people. A lot of community events, GM's were involved. It just had a nice atmosphere, come out of work or school come home and hop onto a game which was fun because of the people.

Sadly, Haven isn't like this at all, there's many battles inside realms too many enemies not many friends. I don't think this server can ever come together and host a server wide tournament like other servers have done in the past. You will mostly see popular people, and by that I mean just familiar faces.

CoR on Haven isn't fun, and that's just the issue. We have too many selfish players and nasty players. People stay in their tight circle of friends and keep others out, anyone new will be frown upon. Then we have such terrible people with shit personalities.


What you just said was exactly how my first year and a half of regnum on haven were
strangely last halfyear a lot changed (inside alsiusrealm) anyway
I dunno if I just wanst aware of it first.. or that it just changed, but there are lots and lots
of friendly ppl on haven too, and I doubt Ra is still as friendly as it used to be
I knew almost every1 from alsius-(end)horus i doubt i can say i know half of alsius atm..

with a bigger playerbase come certain (to me) negative sides too

[Krungle]

We have too many selfish players and nasty players. People stay in their tight circle of friends and keep others out, anyone new will be frown upon. Then we have such terrible people with shit personalities.

There was a person that came over to Alisis (sp) recently from Ignis and that person said she made the switch because of the nastiness of that realm and was glad she did. Perhaps other realms need to learn to be nice or more nice people need to switch to Goat. Maybe this is why Goats are doing so well atm?

Something to think about...

[bois]

Not really Krungle.

These cycles happen all the time. There is no single reason why it happens. It is usually a cocktail of reasons not always containing the same ingredients every time.
Also, all realms have their good or bad. It would be interesting to note that quite a few moved to Ignis and have had good results for doing so. These players are nice, have good interactions and everyone is amicable. Ignis often gets a bad rap because of a few loud but empty barrels.

The irony also is that Ignis , at probably its nastiest, was doing the best it ever did in war. When it became nicer (and trust me, Ignis of today is very nice compared to the past), it lost that edge.

Most of these things depend on when you log, the players you encounter first when you do and that lasting impression that this minority may leave with you. It's the same for all realms. And I am pretty sure that this is not exclusive to this game.

Oh and please stop stereotyping based on the evidence of one person. Corroborating evidence is always helpful. How are you so sure that the migrant wasn't the problem in the first place ?

[VandaMan]

Ignis is the nicest cuz I'm there, so fuck you

[Hollow-Ichigo]

Ignis is the nicest cuz I'm there, so fuck you

I Agree, van is the nicest piece of ugly ass shit ever to grace the sandy pile of period blood that is Ignis :)

[Manuka]

It is worth noting that plenty of players that went off to have a go at GW2 did come back to us. Confirmed.
Additionally, a sequel to DAoC is finally in the works, to be called Camelot Unchained. However, it is likely to be 2014/2015 before we even see a Beta.I think its pretty sure that this project is dead, cause they have only 27 hours left to fund raise about $120.000 (http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained).
EDIT: I was mistaken, nice finish :eek:
I am personally of the opinion that unless NGD finds a considerable investor to throw at this game and does something to increase the quality of gameplay in CoR, it will shrink.Imo NDG already showed with the last years features what is within their limited power for a stronger focus to mass market attraction, but more often this(streamlining by investor demand) could cripple the game finally.

BBT: To counter misusage just include a lets say 12 hour lock for realm switch to at least prevent the hopping of multi realm account players(merge). Note that this does not solve the problem of multi accout players!

[learntoplay]

Haven was good at the start - people actually did stuff. Then they went to just camping their own save.. Which was countered for a brief period by Team Death matches, which were awesome. Now, however, people don't even do those.. they just log in, sit at their own save then zerg anyone who comes to their save looking for a fight.

It's honestly a very boring server to play on. Put on a constant boost, won't get the extremes of 10 people grinding together (which is the case for 2hr boosts), but will always have 2-3 at least in grinding zones so I can go fight them and get them to bring people away from their cs to me and I can fight those too.

Hell, even revert the Warmaster quest so that the kills don't need to be at the fort - this may make people go around the warzone to fight rather than staying at 3 very distant parts of the map all day.

Multirealming? Meh. Multirealming has helped me see just how bad the server is. When people do eventually leave their cs it's darkness 5, confuse 5, mindsquash 5, kick 5 etc etc all day from zergs (who are probably on their way to their own fort which has been captured by very bored other realm after an hour of sitting doing absolutely nothing).

I'm bored. ^^ Bye \o/

[errei]

fuse haven with piranha please =D

[Checkit]

fuse haven with piranha please =D

No. Piranha is an awesome server wherr players love to fight fair. Haven is full of pussies who just run from fair figjts. I don't want piranha ruined. Send haven to ra where the population overshadows playstyles.

[LucianDeathshield]

Haven is full of pussies who just run from fair fights.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[Extol]

I think the key is, they need to make a reward to the realm that defends the noble and gems successfully. This would make it so people wouldn't be tempted to log into the winning side, it would give a reason to fight for the underdog, like 50% xp/gold/drop boost for defending realm for a week if nobles alive and no gems left gate so if a realm is devastated all they have to do is protect noble, so the more underpop the realm is, the easier it gets to acheive said goal.... something along these lines, maybe not exactly like that but my main point reward the successful defense and it will balance people desire to switch realms day to day.

[VandaMan]

I think the key is, they need to make a reward to the realm that defends the noble and gems successfully. This would make it so people wouldn't be tempted to log into the winning side, it would give a reason to fight for the underdog, like 50% xp/gold/drop boost for defending realm for a week if nobles alive and no gems left gate so if a realm is devastated all they have to do is protect noble, so the more underpop the realm is, the easier it gets to acheive said goal.... something along these lines, maybe not exactly like that but my main point reward the successful defense and it will balance people desire to switch realms day to day.

Rewarding successful defense sounds nice, but I think this would actually result in discouraging offense, rather than encouraging defense. If you know your enemies are rewarded for successfully defending from your invasions, very few will want to attempt them unless they have a huge advantage in numbers.

[Kitsuni]

Rewarding successful defense sounds nice, but I think this would actually result in discouraging offense, rather than encouraging defense. If you know your enemies are rewarded for successfully defending from your invasions, very few will want to attempt them unless they have a huge advantage in numbers.
The key here is to add more variation so that a realm can't receive the same reward (i.e a defensive bonus) twice in a row. Instead they would have to work towards building a successful offensive after a successful defense, otherwise they would lose their advantage. Like a perpetual game of tug-of-war.

For example, what if successfully defending your gems meant that you could counter-invade without capturing all the relics? And if the other realm was also successful in defending their gems, they would gain the same right. Meanwhile the third realm is benefiting from noble kills. Something that was once rare and mundane becomes a common occurence and an all-out war, with very little "turtling", as players would constantly be pressed to push their advantage.

And to keep it from becoming boring, the worst-off realm could gain additional offensive advantages, eliminating the current "Alsius Vs Ignis" deadlock that Syrtis is suffering from due to their low population and/or low morale. Players usually don't play simply because they have no chance of winning...

But what if that wasn't the case, even when outnumbered?

[Extol]

Yeah, Kitsuni is on to something, look any correction you do has the potential to be an overcorrection. It's like driving, say you run off the road into the ditch on the right side, if you over correct you will end up in the left ditch, but sometimes thats what it takes to find the middle road..... you know what I'm saying? So yeah if they made the reward for defense too good, it would hurt the desire to go on the offense, at which point either decrease the defense reward or increase the offense reward just a little. It would take time to tweak it, but it could work if implemented correctly.

[JOPAGO]

I think multirealm always bad, for a simple reason: we do not know what your intentions.
You say you play for fun, but what will you do to ensure your enjoyment? Take relic to the enemy? leave dying mate kingdom? Do not give aura, healing, or any kind of support? Giving information to the enemy?
Understand what is the problem? On Server Piranha this kind of attitude is rejected and is prohibited.
You are saying that there is no solution, when in fact it's just ban and delete each kingdom multirealms of important activities, such as invasions, defenses and epic.
You just have to want it.

[badassmaster]

It's a game. People like to experience life on all sides of the realms, which is only natural. As long as they're open about it, don't use their accounts to sabotage invasions or relics, then I really couldn't care.

[Checkit]

Pardon the thread title. :)

Over time I've spoke to many multirealmers, and the large majority that I have known do not realize that they are doing anything wrong by multirealming. They have absolutely no concept of how it harms the game, and believe that they are only having fun by playing the most active realm at any given time. So I've made a little list of reasons why it is harmful, to help educate those who do not quite understand the issues that it presents.

1) Multirealmers tend to join the winning side, not the losing side.
They just want to have fun, afterall, its a game. But this tilts an already unwinnable batle further in the favor of the enemy. In many cases, this can make a critical difference, now that the game has moved from holding multiple forts for a set period of time, to holding only one fort at a time. This makes it easy for just a few more players to heavily influence the outcome.

2) Multirealmers tend to switch sides to kill the noble during invasion.
Who can honestly resist all those warmaster coins? Its not uncommon for people to switch to the winning realm to get noble kills. The problem here is that the invading realm almost always tends to have the advantage, due to how the game is designed, in a way that gives all advantages to the realm that is already advantaged (positive feedback loops). Again, this puts the losing realm at a further disadvantage, not having that player to help defend.

3) Multirealmers cannot be realistically trusted.
Someone who plays multiple realms is a logical intelligence risk and cannot be trusted not to share information. Many people see this as minor; what harm could something like telilng the other realm what fort is going to be attacked? Until a force of only five people get there to find it camped by ten enemies. Those who I have known over the years see this as "creating action", but in reality, its an action-killer, because it tilts balance to the defensive side.

4) It is hard to consider a multirealmer to be an ally.
Many chose not to support multis because they have a tendancy to switch whenever it is convenient for them, not when it is convenient for the realm. This can lead to things like getting killed by a friend and then switching to kill them in return. It creates mistrust between players.

In short... multirealming does have a significant effect on the game. In the old days, it wasn't as common as it was now, as there were no boosts and grinding a char in another realm was very difficult. Now with the introduction of boosts, more premium items, merged accounts, etc. it has become much more common, with many players thinking its just way to enjoy the game better, without realizing that they are making the game worse for everyone else, including their own friends.

I realize that realm pride doesn't mean anything to some people, but it is a very nice concept that can help your realm overcome the odds.

There are so many fallacies, ignorant, and misleading statements and assumptions in this post it is pathetic.

[JOPAGO]

Precisely because it is a game, is that we have to consider everyone's enjoyment.
If it were to be multirealm, there would be the option to choose a kingdom. Keep in mind q server Haven only exists because multirealm Gamesamba wins anymore. She's not caring if some go sabotaging, what matters is the ximerim you buy, after all, the money spent on 9 chars, at least, is high.
I think the disadvantages of multireinos is less than the disadvantages. because nimguém can ensure good attitude.
Yes, Regnum is a game, and have clear rules how to choose just one kingdom to defend. Do not like a kingdom, replace. If the community of Haven (the Piranha is forbidden) feel undermined by these players, it would be important to talk with the company and force it to prohibit multirealm.

[errei]

Precisely because it is a game, is that we have to consider everyone's enjoyment.
If it were to be multirealm, there would be the option to choose a kingdom. Keep in mind q server Haven only exists because multirealm Gamesamba wins anymore. She's not caring if some go sabotaging, what matters is the ximerim you buy, after all, the money spent on 9 chars, at least, is high.
I think the disadvantages of multireinos is less than the disadvantages. because nimguém can ensure good attitude.
Yes, Regnum is a game, and have clear rules how to choose just one kingdom to defend. Do not like a kingdom, replace. If the community of Haven (the Piranha is forbidden) feel undermined by these players, it would be important to talk with the company and force it to prohibit multirealm.

google translate eh um lixo meu amigo.
tente pelo menos revisar o texto depois de usá-lo

[JOPAGO]

Eu iria revisar, mas não achei que se importariam com termos em vez da mensagem.
Quando escrevem em portugues traduzido e dá para todos entenderem, ninguém implica com o cara. :/
Fala sério.

[JOPAGO]

Eu iria revisar, mas não achei que se importariam com termos em vez da mensagem.
Quando escrevem em portugues traduzido e dá para todos entenderem, ninguém implica com o cara lá no nosso fórum :/
Fala sério.