I just noticed this.

[SolomonDean]

<DkySven> the big problem with balance discussions on the Regnum forum is that a lot of people just suck at playing their class....

While I agree to some extent I hope this is not going to be the generic response when people in the RO community complain about the issues of balance. In my opinion Balance is a evolution never completed always evolving. If you look at RO in a constant state of evolution and been around long enough you will see at some point in the game one class or another had way more advantages then another class. I have come to the realization that while I may not be happy with all my classes abilities and skills I am certain this will change as more updates come out. After banging my head against the wall for 2+ years on this game I decide to take a different approach on what I expect from a mmo company I actually spend money on. I call it Patience.

[Hamster_of_sorrow]

i have to agree with just about everything you just said although i would like to add something:

if that is the attitude that NGD takes towards balance discussions, nothing productive will get done. while many posts regarding balance are just whiners (yea i know, ive been there), there are some very helpful and constructive posts. its just tough to sort the good from the bad.

[e30G]

Note:

<DkySven> the big problem with balance discussions on the Regnum forum is that a lot of people just suck at playing their class....

He did not say all. I do agree a lot don't know how to play well, and some people view their ineffectiveness as proof of imbalance.

So:

Originally Posted by Hamster_of_sorrow

if that is the attitude that NGD takes towards balance discussions, nothing productive will get done.

I believe that if NGD listens too much to what everyone has to say, then nothing productive will truly get done. Every player suggestion has to be taken with a grain of salt. NGD has the data set (objective), the players get to feel the impact (subjective). The tough part is finding a balance in subjective and objective feedback.

[SolomonDean]

Originally Posted by e30ernest

Note:
The tough part is finding a balance in subjective and objective feedback.

Dude Balance is Balance if its done properly. No need to spin shit. I love how so many people come to the defence of NGD cause apparently they never have anything to add. I get a faster response talking to my wall.

http://www.regnumonline.com.ar/forum...4&postcount=10

[e30G]

Originally Posted by SolomonDean

Dude Balance is Balance if its done properly.

You are correct. That's why they don't have to listen to you. What may be balanced in their eyes and data set might not be what you comprehend as "balanced".

And no I am not defending NGD. I have nothing to gain from it in the same way as you have nothing to gain from bashing them.

[SolomonDean]

Originally Posted by e30ernest

You are correct. That's why they don't have to listen to you. What may be balanced in their eyes and data set might not be what you comprehend as "balanced".

And no I am not defending NGD. I have nothing to gain from it in the same way as you have nothing to gain from bashing them.

I prefer to call it disgruntled criticism.

[DkySven]

I wonder where you got that from

Anyway, that is my personal opinion which I do not take with me when moderating. On top of that, I am not a part of NGD, but simply do some volunteer work for them. I make no balance decisions at all and you don't need to worry. This is just something personal I said in a chatroom.

I still agree with what I said in that quote though.

However, that would not mean I think NGD shouldn't listen to people's balance suggestions, I just think they should take care when reading them.

[Raideniza]

Originally Posted by DkySven

I wonder where you got that from

same where I got this from:

<+DkySven> gotta help my mother with the dishes

[ncvr]

The same is true of all PvP-oriented games. There is a significant difference between the skill of an average player and having an average amount of skill, because the average player is absolutely terrible.

As for balance...people really seem to be looking at it the wrong way. Balance isn't just a measurement of how powerful a class is or how much a class can theoretically do, it's about how much skill the player playing that class needs to succeed, in relation to the skill required of players playing other classes. If you look at it that way, it becomes a lot more simple.

[Seher]

Originally Posted by Necrovarus

As for balance...people really seem to be looking at it the wrong way. Balance isn't just a measurement of how powerful a class is or how much a class can theoretically do, it's about how much skill the player playing that class needs to succeed, in relation to the skill required of players playing other classes. If you look at it that way, it becomes a lot more simple.

Both are important, and it gets less and less simple the more points you take into consideration. :P
You need to look at if it's even possible to handle a solution, or if another would be better (technically)
You need to look at possible exploits
You need to look at combinations with other spells that might become too strong (well not in RO, there are no combinations hehe)
And you need to look at the fun you have winning or losing because of this or that...

Or in a nutshell, balance is not "I've lost, do something about it" (that's what many here think), balance means the practical realisation of theoretical thoughts based on practical observations. :-P