[POLL]Remove MOBS Higher Than Level 37 From Inner Zone [Archive]

ieti

04-30-2010, 10:27 AM

We all know how boring War Zone can be in Horus - maybe on other servers too. Main problem because this happens is that most of grinders are in Inner Zone where they have good cozy grinding spots. This keeps them distant and unwilling to fight alot players. They do not care whats happens into War Zone, because they have mobs and safety.

Bringing grinders after level 37 into War Zone will make them willing to participate in hunts, fort fights because this will give them safety to grind. This will teach them to work in teams, because you have to protect grinder next to you, so he will help you next time when you're in trouble. This in other side will give to lower players knowledge what spells and setups are used against them, and they will be close to more experienced players that are constantly in War Zone.

I really really see no downsides to move all higher mobs to be only in War Zone and even give XP bonus of grinding there. This is war game and Inner zone is only to be used till you get your level 5 powers.

Game in Horus became boring... (http://www.regnumonline.com.ar/forum/showthread.php?p=1019506)

http://iwconstructions.com/Regnum/slides/0010.jpg
http://iwconstructions.com/Regnum/slides/0011.jpg

Slides are from Piz's comic.

NotScias

04-30-2010, 10:43 AM

Bah... A grinder is a grinder... Moving the mobs in WZ won't stop them grinding... If they don't want to participate in fort wars/hunts they won't either no matter where the grinding spots are...

ieti

04-30-2010, 10:51 AM

Sure it will not stop them i know, but it will be alot easier to come to help at fort when you grind near it, or go into hunt group to kill a hunter, or even find a party to get better XP and be more protected.

After level 37 on both my chars i grinded in war zone. Sure sometimes it can be annoying to be ganked, but you can get clanmates to help you, you can go with them when you get bored etc etc etc.

Lower levels can have alot more fun, and we will have more fun to help to them. All happy :P

Minorian

04-30-2010, 11:04 AM

This is one of the worst ideas Ive seen. Why do you want this? If i want to grind Im not going to be stopped by having to grind in the wz, Ill just grumble a bit on rlm chat. NTM i do alot of my grinding in qaaz anyway. The only reason i could see someone wanting this implemented would be so their hunter can get more rps.

ieti

04-30-2010, 11:10 AM

When Horus started there was some high mob populated places in War Zone. We called them g-Spots. There we got constantly grind parties, because mobs spawned fast. Conjus was happy, knights was happy, other classes was happy too. If something happened we moved from gspots to forts fast and we have constant fights all the time. Then gspots was removed.....

Why you put hunters only there? I want to put grinders and high level players to work together - we will have more fights and more team work.

RP's meeeh....why we put rp's here?

Arafails

04-30-2010, 11:22 AM

Well, yeah, we've been saying this for a while. To those worried about hunters, well, we used to grind in the warzone all the time (heck, in Ignis, it's still a neccessity really), and we would form groups or just suck it up and try to outsmart the hunter – it's good war training.

Nowadays you notify people that there's a hunter or hunt group near where you're grinding you'll probably be told at length to grind inner realm – so why bother having mobs in the warzone at all?

Mattdoesrock

04-30-2010, 12:43 PM

Absolutely agree.

Gytha_Ogg

04-30-2010, 01:18 PM

Rodillus

04-30-2010, 01:21 PM

I've been grinding my Hunter in the WZ a lot near both Shaan save and Shaan beach. I saw it as an excellent tradeoff between grinding and supporting the WZ effort when Shaan (and sometimes Samal) was under attack. Being close to the WZ action made it easy to interrupt my grinding and fight, and then return to grinding once the fight is over.

Try doing that when you're grinding on Ruins Beach or Mele Beach. I was not very tempted at helping when grinding there because of the long run/ride. I did help on some occasions but I got more selective on the scenarios that required my help. Grinding closer to the action did make a difference in my case.

Gawyn_Trakkand

04-30-2010, 01:29 PM

hunting in the warzone is depressing the gameplay is slow and enemies are few and far between you are lucky if you get to kill 4 different players every hunt. Big deal if you get killed whilst grinding it'll get you used to expecting the un-expected and it'll liven up gameplay.

Silent_Shadow

04-30-2010, 02:01 PM

I almost always grind in the wz because i hate grinding and fort wars give me an excuse to stop. But there have been some times where i grinded inner zone because of enemy players or there was a nice group there.

Hamster_of_sorrow

04-30-2010, 02:43 PM

having lvl 37+ mobs move to WZ (most ignis already are anyway save for mele beach grinders) will just be more food for hunters.

Mikan

04-30-2010, 03:23 PM

This is a good suggestion.

However, I am also going to tell you why.

Back in the early days of RA, there were no mobs over level 35 in inner realm, and warzone was populated with SERIOUS mobs, not all of these little level 20 fluffy toys that we have now. It was a dangerous place, with grinding parties and hunting parties everywhere.

For every hunting party, there was a grinding party that could out class them. In fact, during this time, I even watched frequently as mere grinding parties took down entire war parties near forts, because they were all skilled for damage (Grinders) and support (Conjurors) and back then Conjurors got alot of experience from support... it was more efficient than levelling alone.

This won't make the warzone worse. Especially on Horus, it will bring almost everyone to the warzone at last, and you will see almost the entire server population around areas with mid-to-high level mobs. This would also significantly reduce "trader players", as they would no longer be able to loot without visting the warzone and participating in some fights.

There has always been many players in support of reverting this change.

So to summarize, this is a good idea. But you would have to see how it was on RA to understand why, and why the game went to crap when they removed it. Putting high-level mobs in inner realm was the start of all the boredom that is now Regnum Online.

Has the game really only become about painting premium armors, riding around on horses and trading items?

Kind regards.

Zordak

04-30-2010, 03:28 PM

I dont see the point in grinding on monsters all the time. If Regnum claims to be a war game, it should focus the gameplay into a pvp or group vs. group fight direction.
Moving monsters to safe places, allowing to grind unbothered, was one of the worst and most stupid decisions the development team has ever made. And they deserve to be reminded of that till it is undone.

Yes, the rate of death experiences while levelling would raise. Yes, you would be able to get your vengeance when youre fed up with grinding. When levelling alone - which should not be encouraged if this game is RvR (->group based) - you will be more vulnerable to hunters.
On the other hand groups are the only protection you currently have against the hunter class. I think this would rather reduce the numbers of hunters and balance the other class population forming hunting groups.

Though this all happened during times with a different balance scheme, you can ask any of the players around for long enough to have high level monsters only in wz: I think 90% will agree that moving them inside was a bad idea.
My suspicion is that it was done in the frame of "mainstreaming" the game when the first distribution contracts were formed with gamigo.

Z.

Arafails

04-30-2010, 03:44 PM

I'm also going to add that this should only be done with the removal of realm chat from the warzone.

Why? Because with no way to communicate globally people will be less inclined to grind without a party, and I believe less inclined to grumble when they do.

Froste

04-30-2010, 04:24 PM

UmarilsStillHere

04-30-2010, 04:27 PM

and get rid of all those bloody level 10-20 mobs all over the goddamn place. I think that decision was even more retarded than placing highlevels in inner.

I agree, whats with all those low-lev Igneos all over the desert from Samal to Meni, does anyone ever grind on those? Do low levels even know they are there? Such a waste of server space.

e30G

04-30-2010, 05:05 PM

Bah... A grinder is a grinder... Moving the mobs in WZ won't stop them grinding... If they don't want to participate in fort wars/hunts they won't either no matter where the grinding spots are...

No. With grinders already at the warzone, they don't have to run through half the map to join a war effort.

In addition to removing highlevel mobs from inner the whole mob placement in the warzone needs to be redone, and get rid of all those bloody level 10-20 mobs all over the goddamn place. I think that decision was even more retarded than placing highlevels in inner.

I definitely agree with this. That was a retarded move indeed. A lot of the excitement in the warzone was lost with moving low level mobs into the warzone. The aggro back then was something to watch out for in a war. Now low level mobs are rather insignificant when it comes to misplaced areas.

I'd like to add to what Mikan said too. With the movement of high level mobs to the inner realm, we also began to see player skill level get lower and more whiners on the forum. I attribute this mostly to players gaining high level characters without learning to play them. Grinding and war is very different in this game.

Gytha_Ogg

04-30-2010, 05:55 PM

I agree with getting the high level mobs out of inner, and voted that way, but I do have a few questions. Obviously, this used to be the case, and then there was a change that moved high mobs into to inner. I'm assuming somebody didn't just spill coffee on their keyboard, and while mopping it up accidentally coded a function to move mobs around.

What was the reason the mobs were moved to inner?
Did it work for its intended purpose?
If it did work as designed, are there changes that could solve the problems everybody's been talking about in this thread?
If it didn't, are there problems with rolling it back? (Everything changed underneath it so it's not a simple roll-back, etc.)

backe

04-30-2010, 05:59 PM

I'm still of the opinion that adding high level mobs to the inner realm was one of the worst decisions that NGD has made to date.

Edit:

Gytha-
IIRC3 NGD's reasoning was to make the game friendlier to newer players. I think it actually did the opposite in such a manner that reduced player interaction e.g. players in the war-zone playing an MMO vs. solo grinders behind the gates playing a single-player game. If anything it made the war-zone a less populated much more hunter (the class, not players necessarily looking for pvp) friendly place.

ieti

04-30-2010, 08:06 PM

True, grinders can form parties. At such grind party when i grinded my lock near our gate(i was around 35 maybe). All we was in party, so when i was killed i ressed on gate and pushed coordinates into party chat. We was 5-6 players near that level, but we managed to find hunter while he tried to kill next from our party and kill it. It was alot of fun. Level 50 hunter was killed by low levels - awesome feeling! :viking:

Syrtis high level gspot was at PB1 beach, so when we was bored we was on road to samal. If ignis was bored they attacked us because place was good for them too.

At early Horus days everyone grinded in WZ. There i got lots of advices from Oro, Mele, Galynn met Arwen and many many more who shared knowledge, exchanged drops, do stupid things while we grinded and fighted together.

It was awesome times. Hope NGD rethink this and bring back ppl into War Zone where is the place for them in this WAR game.

Adding of global realm chat, and putting high level mob's into inner really pushed the game into this. Players become splitted from each other, and we see less and less teamwork, friendship and fun...it is sad...

bois

04-30-2010, 08:32 PM

I think everyone knows my position on this. I have long held the belief that high level mobs should not exist in the inner area.

What I found to be totally ridiculous is the appearance of mobs OVER level 50 in the inner area. Why should that be? It can't possibly be that you need a cocoon of protection at level 47 to 50 or do you?

I would propose this. As the others said, remove all the minor irritant Mobs that exist around the forts. I understand the rationale that the lower level mobs are to encourage low level players to come out and grind while they possibly get an atmosphere of war.
It simply does not work though. There is absolutely no benefit to grinding in a danger zone which is populated by high level hunters which even level 50s
struggle to cope with. There is simply no benefit. The drops are no better, the XP is no better, the risk is exponentially higher so why go outside?

Next, at level 37- 40 there should be available mobs both inner realm and outer realm . This provides a softer landing for the transition process.

On top of this there must be a reason why you would want to switch. Towards this end I propose that either a minor XP boost, and or a better drop rate differential exists between the mobs at these levels for inner versus war zone.
You have to make players WANT to come outside with the promise of a better rate of return. To force them outside in these initial stages will just frustrate players and cause a drop-off.

from 41 or 42 the player will now have to be weaned from the system protection now. Their fate should now rest in their abilities, the realm community and your clan, grinding party.

I see only good things coming with the removal of the level 42+ Mobs from inner realm.

First thing is the player has to learn how to play. No more can you rely on the same 3 or 4 spells over and over killing mob after mob to work. You will now have to skill and know these skills to survive.

Secondly, you will learn the fundamentals of RvR. No longer can you sit in a corner and consistently rely on yourself. You now will learn the fundamentals of team operation in order to survive. This can only auger well for better battles than we have now.

Thirdly you will learn the fundamentals of observation of both your environment and more importantly you team mate. Knowing their game play is sometime vital to your own survival. As you progress in team play, the formation of units will be easy and play quality will rise substantially.

Lastly things like level 50 career grinder will find it just a little harder to operate without participating in the affairs of the realm. If the realm is swarming with hunters you will have to get off your hands and actually do something so you can grind.

What are the arguments against?
Well it could be said that the realm doesn't protect grinders properly.
Too much risk for no pay off.
I don't like getting killed.
I have a grinding build and a war build and i can't defend my self.
Hunter ganks me over and over.

All these problems will occur initially but , with time the community will adjust like it has done for every other change ever made. We will lose some players, we will gain some but I am sure in my mind that it will be in the best interest for the server and the game as a whole.

Regards
Artec

WhateverUSMC

04-30-2010, 08:50 PM

Sorry, but I chose 'No'.

For me, sometimes I do not have time to go to war every single time some fort is taken. I have the right to play this game as I see fit (as long as I am not breaking any rules), and in a given day, if I just want to reach the next level, I should be able to without being shanked by hunting parties.

I'm sort of guessing that this idea won't happen, because then the players who have bought scrolls wouldn't be able to use them when they want, and after a while, they simply won't be bought anymore, which = less money for NGD.

Godot

04-30-2010, 09:00 PM

Lastly things like level 50 career grinder will find it just a little harder to operate without participating in the affairs of the realm. If the realm is swarming with hunters you will have to get off your hands and actually do something so you can grind.

What are the arguments against?
Well it could be said that the realm doesn't protect grinders properly.
Too much risk for no pay off.
I don't like getting killed.
I have a grinding build and a war build and i can't defend my self.
Hunter ganks me over and over.

I dont like it for exactly the reasons Artec points out.
If a player finds his fun in just grinding its not for me or anyone else to force
them into the wz.

All this will do is create a non stop hunt-a-thon, and really ? dont we have enough of that already? I also don't see many sub level 50s supporting this
in the thread, it kind of looks like its mostly high level players lookin for easy
RP.

Also as anyone in Ignis can testify, from about 37-45 you are forced to grind the wz anyway,so the propostition seems kind of reduntant.
I dont know about the other realms.
I really dont have an opinion about drop grinding as I only do enough to
generate repair costs.

Froste

05-01-2010, 02:51 AM

A couple of points Godot; While most people in the thread have multiple level 50s some of the people have actually experienced a time when the only way to grind was in the warzone. I think it sounds very accusatory to assume that everyone who posts does so out of an ulterior motive to gain easy realmpoints.

I can only speak for myself, I had a lot more fun when the grind existed purely in the warzone and my motive is only the desire to share that fun among the players who've never experienced it. Back then it could surely get hazardous at times, but it created a very deep rooted sense of protecting your realm's grinders, and increased the sense of camaraderie; Grinders would yell for help when hunters came, and not just hunters but small to medium sized skirmish groups, the defending realm usually organized a protection detail very rapidly to aid the grinders. In fact it was one of my favourite things to do back on Ra to patrol the (old) menirah save area and keep our people safe.

It's a part of the game that has been lost since then, and it's a great shame because it was an awful lot of fun, and I'm saddened that people don't get to experience it anymore.

Mbwana

05-01-2010, 03:18 AM

my experience grinding a lvl 35~ conj in WZ

I love it, I actually looked forward to being attacked by a hunter.....not because I'm crazy (not completely anyway) but because I HATE grinding and occational fights with hunters or whatever (even if I lose 99% of the time) offers a break from the mind numbing hell that is grinding.

also, by grinding with more experienced players in WZ I learned a few things about pvp, like when one gets attacked by a hunter, always aim for the pet first...a noob like me learned to defend himself (somewhat)!! xD

ofc, I'm the kind that don't mind dying, I'm addicted to wars and I got awesome realm mates who answers my call for help, but I can see not everyone would be in the same boat (they may actually be sane)

as a compromise, why not give bonus exp when grinding in WZ? I think this has already been suggested before and I like the idea

Dupa_z_Zasady

05-01-2010, 07:04 AM

In addition to removing highlevel mobs from inner the whole mob placement in the warzone needs to be redone, and get rid of all those bloody level 10-20 mobs all over the goddamn place. I think that decision was even more retarded than placing highlevels in inner.

I strongly agree. Hunters are nothing compared to those low level annoying aggro craps standing one to another. Remove low level mobs and place those over 37lvl instead. I also think that mobs should be placed in the way that would make higher levels to grind in points that are most distant from saves and gates, and opposite, lvl 35-37 mobs should be placed close to gates and saves.

Mr_Egg

05-01-2010, 09:18 AM

What are the arguments against?
Well it could be said that the realm doesn't protect grinders properly. Well in that case, the realm will have to learn to protect their grinders, which = more teamwork = better wars at the end of the day. This is also part of why I disagree with those that say to get rid of realm chat, because the realm chat helps to get the message out about hunters, and therefore might increase teamwork.... however, the way realm chat is currently spammed with items, I think it'd be a good idea to implement a trade chat channel... but that's going off topic, so back on:

Too much risk for no pay off.
And on this point, as a few have already said, increase exp/drop rate outside, so that it does pay off

I don't like getting killed.
I have a grinding build and a war build and i can't defend my self.
Hunter ganks me over and over. .... which encourages party grinding, which again, encourages teamwork and leads to better gameplay and more fun.

Now I'm very aware that the person who posted that was standing for the high level mobs being taken out of inner realm, but the point of this post was to prove that the downsides.... actually have bigger upsides.

So yes, I agree that the high level mobs should stay in the warzone :D

Revolverxxx

05-01-2010, 10:37 AM

I sort of agree but disagree at the same time. Both sides of the coin have good and bad features, so why not agree to meet each other halfway.

What I would like to see is the higher lvl mobs in the inner realm stay the same but the concentration of mobs in the wz increased greatly. Maybe even a warzone bonus (+WZ). Make people want to grind in the warzone, not because they don't have a choice, but because the rewards are greater. and these mobs shouldn't be hostile, because with the abundace of mobs, the last thing you want is ten rapid werewolves chasing you around constantly. If possible, make mobs hostile to enemy realm players respectively.

I agree with a lot of the points that the game has evolved negatively with the addition of inner realm high lvl mobs effected gameplay strategies. It has, you learn nothing from grinding inner realm, but again it should still be an option (not necissarily the best option). A +WZ bonus would encourage use of premium boosters if anything. Fighting in fort wars etc doesn't waste any of your booster time anyway so I don't see why that's an issue.

ieti

05-01-2010, 02:16 PM

Revolverxxx

05-01-2010, 03:53 PM

Experience Boosters have a bug - they activate when you hit enemy player. Usually boosters activate when you hit a mob, and their timer stop after time when you do nothing. Bad thing is that if you have booster on when you hit enemy player booster timer activates. This have to be fixed for sure. It eats your booster and makes premium grinders to do not want to help realm.

Boosters should not stop players from participating into wars and hunts.

On the character I'm grinding up at the moment, and I've been on a constant boost from level 30 (I'm 45 now). I go to war whenever possible and I have never ever noticed this bug you speak of. Boosters have a ten second countdown after the last mob you hit which isn't really that much.

Comp

05-01-2010, 11:55 PM

+1 from me on this one.

As most know I'm a RA veteran and have been around the game for a really long time. Back when grinding parties and individuals were present in the warzone (because that's where all the mobs were) made playing far more enjoyable.

People think that moving the mobs out in to the wz will only give hunters "food". While that is true, more and more people will grind in groups and that actually will deter many of the hunters.

Besides....why on earth play this game if your not going to experience war until your high level? That's one problem with Horus in general - lots of high lvls that do not have much WZ experience.

Trust me...doing this will create FAR more fights with FAR larger numbers.

Godot

05-02-2010, 01:13 AM

Froste

05-02-2010, 01:44 AM

This thread is not 'about' horus, nor is it about ra, or the old days. It's about rethinking the mob placement. You make it sound as if my arguments are invalid simply because I played ra; I described the old times to try to convey how an element of gameplay had been taken out which could easily come again if the stupid mobs were to be shifted around to a more optimal configuration.

And the mob relocation happened long before 1.0, back when ra went live, though the addition of highlevel mobs in inner realm came later. It was a retarded decision then (level <20 mobs in warzone), it's still a retarded decision now. The decision to move highlevel mobs into the frontier was less retarded but certainly stupid in terms of war activity. But I guess you're indifferent to what I'm saying.

If the purpose of the game for someone is to do nothing but grind without the threat of being killed by enemies ever then they probably joined the wrong game.

It really was a lot more fun when the grinding was done in the warzone exclusively, both for grinding, hunting, and guarding.

ieti

05-02-2010, 08:15 AM

Thread is not about Horus and RP. I personally have only mages - Conju, Warlock. I rarely hunt and mostly fight at forts. Problem i want to be fixed is splitting peoples by safety wall. It is like it was before in Europe. We was splitted by a wall, by borders and every side knowed very little for other side and cared NADA.

When child get to 7 years he goes to school, no matter that he do not want to. Then univercity, then work, family. You have to follow some things in our society. Same is Regnum - you start in a War game, but you do not want to do war?? You get level 37 and level 5 powers, but you do not want to war again?? People get farmed and call for your help, but you refuse, because you are in inner and do not want to war?? This is absurd situation.

With all war ready people in one place i.e. in War Zone you have to care about people around you, you have to care about your clan, because you are in real life situation. It is war around and you have to get this in account. This will build even stronger community.

Most good places to grind in syrtis are in war zone. You go to grind around gate, then South bay, around CS, Eferias beach or around PP. After 35 you can grind all your way to 50 in WZ. But some people do not place his nose out till 50 and what we get - suicidal, zergy etc. players. No coordination no thinking. This can be teached in grind phase in WZ.

Look at this list. How many of this characters you see to fight. Most of time they grind, grind, grind. And they are level 50 from loong time.

#1 Beijing Ignis Skelics Conjurer 50 29.393.777
#2 Fuerst Ignis Skelics Warlock 50 23.865.337
#3 prettykitty Syrtis Wood Elf Conjurer 50 18.345.476
#4 Healerous Alsius Nordo Conjurer 50 17.889.839
#5 Quick Silver Alsius Dwarf Hunter 50 16.925.079
#6 Biwie Syrtis Wood Elf Hunter 50 16.380.407
#7 Klos Alsius Dwarf Marksman 50 16.337.025
#8 Turrican Syrtis Wood Elf Conjurer 50 16.060.637
#9 rami Ignis Dark Elf Conjurer 50 15.607.132
#10 Mephisto Blitzkrieg Alsius Nordo Conjurer 50 15.462.519

I'm not seen Beijing from a long time, Rami never. Prettykitty only grinds in inner realm, quick silver do not remember too.

Regnum is not pure PvE game, so people that are higher level have to get War and PvE. If i want only PvE i play other games. This is war game.

Freduardo

05-02-2010, 09:41 AM

I do agree with you that incentives need to be given to move people into the warzone to grind (especially for syrtis, the two others cannot grind inside at certain levels). Be it by moving all 37+ mobs to WZ, or at least give higher drop rate and bonus xp in WZ.

You bringing up that list however is completely ridiculous.
Beijing, Fuerst, Biwie, Klos, Healer, QS, Meph ... lol yeah they are really passive players who only grind (Not!).
They have alts, or just fight on their mains, and as for the Alsius players; if they grind, they grind in WZ.

Maybe you always log off when your zerg isn't online, but others might just grind in the many dead hours of horus.

Mikan

05-02-2010, 09:45 AM

I suggest to all people who play Regnum for things other than war, uninstall it and install Perfect World (http://pwi.perfectworld.com/).

You won't regret it.

As for those who enjoy war... let's keep hoping for another balance patch. :smile:
(And hopefully the mob placement will be fixed, too.)

Kind regards.

ieti

05-02-2010, 09:54 AM

Freduardo maybe i'm mistaking on some players on the list - i just picked it from the XP ranking. I'm sorry for this. I do not want to argue with you i know that for you i'm ZERG player. Conju is zerg class i know. Sure i have work, family and i prefer if horus is dead and there are no fights to logout. Better do something for myself than afk or grind.

XP ranking was mistake to put here it gives no accurate information. xD

+1 Mikan

SlackerLinux2

05-02-2010, 10:07 AM

#1 Beijing Ignis Skelics Conjurer 50 29.393.777
I'm not seen Beijing from a long time,

afaik Beijing hasnt played in a LONG time but when he did he did do war alot(and yes dropgrind alot too). kinda interesting hes still #1 on there after all this time

Gourmandine

05-02-2010, 10:14 AM

Why not let the mobs where they are, but remove the evade chance for mobs in wz?
This way we still have the choice. (I read the previous messages fast, sorry if it has already been proposed)

Klutu

05-02-2010, 04:28 PM

i think anyone lvl 30+ should be out in the warzone - Make Low lvl 30-33+ mobs close to saves/forts so higher lvls can be close for assistance

Put high lvl mobs in back areas like the beaches and near all the major bridges

lvl 29- should be in the realm quests and such lvl 30 should begin the warzone/grind

Not Enough people grind in the warzone and i don't get why. i find it's alot more Enjoyable knowing u might get ganked by someone - being able to take a break from the grind and go straight to a war is always nice - would see alot more experienced high lvls if this was to be implemented..

Also about the EXP rankings you brought up..

Quick Silver mostly plays his lock - while he grinds on his hunter he's always tracking the areas too make sure people arnt getting attacked..

Healerous is always in war.. and has become my favorite conj :p

Klos is almost always in a war and if it's quiet he grinds - nothing wrong with that..

Blitzkrieg is a grind alt.. setup for grindjur

BigManOnCampus

05-02-2010, 06:10 PM

I would rather this be taken care of with a 10% war zone xp bonus. Let those who want to grind while semi-afk continue to do so, it is very helpful for those of us trying to live normal lives outside of this game. I agree there should be something to encourage people to not graduate wholly inside their own realm, but lets not force everyone to do so.

I think you guys have a good point in that the war zone needs to be better populated with players and high level mobs. HOWEVER, I know a lot of great adults who play this game and they like to grind while doing laundry, cooking, paying bills, etc..etc... I'd like to see those people continue to play. If you force those people to dedicate all their attention to the game while playing, you'll see them leave. It helps when you realize these people also have money to spend (Generally).

On the character I'm grinding up at the moment, and I've been on a constant boost from level 30 (I'm 45 now). I go to war whenever possible and I have never ever noticed this bug you speak of. Boosters have a ten second countdown after the last mob you hit which isn't really that much.

I have never seen this bug either. First I've even heard of it and I certainly have gone back and forth between boost-grind and war a number of times and not noticed any issue.

Mr_Egg

05-02-2010, 07:22 PM

Not Enough people grind in the warzone and i don't get why. i find it's alot more Enjoyable knowing u might get ganked by someoneYeah, the risk makes it more fun, I agree with that, but the only times after level 35 or so (with my lock, at least) that I grinded in the inner zone was when the hunters farmed me. If you kill me once, fair enough.... twice, ok, I can see that you might've turned around and gone back past me and killed me on the way.... but to sit and kill someone worth very few rps over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over... is ridiculous.

You might say "go to another grind spot then"..... but sometimes you do, and then there are hunters farming there too, so they kill you 3-4 times, and you go back to the first grind spot, and the same first hunting party kills you again... so in this case, it's go back on the inside, where there are sometimes more players than mobs, and get very little exp, but more than you'd be getting if you sat and let the same trolls bash you again.

I'm not gonna name any names, but anyone who's been grinding in the wz on horus (especially at "hotspots" like efe beach) knows exactly who the farming hunters are.... and that's why inner realms are so crowded, and that's what ruins the teamwork, and that's inevitably what causes massive zergs of idiots... which causes more grindaholics who never war, and amplifies the zerg effect...

...... [/rant] :rolleyes2:

Aries202

05-02-2010, 08:14 PM

I have to agree, back then grinding inside war zone was much more exciting. Yes sometimes it is frustrating, but that is where the realm steps in, and help those levelers. People on Ra always had a char near the training spots in war zone, just in case the trainers are raided. Though you have to keep in mind, if the high level mobs are removed from inner zone, then NGD will also have to bring back realm chat into war zone, because if those levelers are to get raided and camped, how will they contact everyone. Keep in mind not everyone can purchase a banner, but then again most of everyone is in a Clan. Though not everyone can rely on their clans, not every clan is active.

bois

05-03-2010, 01:19 PM

I think , more and more the point is being proven.

A few comments:

While I agree that players should have the latitude to do whatever they like, this game is supposed to be a medieval, war based, Realm vs Realm game primarily. The parameters for this game have to and must be very biased towards this end.
Grinding, while entertaining at times is really a means to an end and a way to stretch the longevity of the game. It is not a focus. I am sorry and mean no disrespect to anyone but if someone wants to become a career grinder, this may not be the best game to do so. The grind is generally boring with little variety, lack of diversity of mobs, little challenge and marginal payoff. What is the point of gaining 25 million XP which has very little use or 30 million gold which is practically worthless since magnanite?

The reasons that make grinding difficult are precisely the reasons why we need to make this change.
You have mobs both inside and in war zone now. Players choose both inside and outside to grind. This is where the problem lies. You have a ton of players inner realm grinding along happily inner realm while a few take the risk outside. These players including the level 49 and 50 players who have absolutely no reason to grind inside are there taking absolutely no part in the realm affairs and to be honest they cannot be bothered.
So, we have a few adventurous ones willing to take risks and become frustrated when they get ganked over and over. Thing is, if the others were outside , would players get taken out so often?
Meleketi beach is a fine example. Sometime 5-6 even more players are there while the swamps, Shaanarid and the Orc Camp area are practically deserted . If those 5-6 were outside would hunters have a good chance? They might be able to pick one but success would be mainly thwarted.

I think people need to look beyond the system babysitting them. I honestly believe that if this continues then this server and the quality of its battles will continue to deteriorate. People are generally adverse to change and a movement out of their comfort zone. The reactions are merely a knee jerk reaction to this.

A quick suggestion: for those who don't like the idea of actually having the risk of dying, I always wondered why NGD never implemented a scroll of immunity. Such a scroll would provide immunity for a set period. That should satisfy the ones who like to multi task and have money to spend (generally).

ieti

05-03-2010, 01:37 PM

I really do not see what is wrong to grind in War Zone on boosters. I grinded my warlock mostly on boosters, because i was sick of whole that grinding after i graded my conjurer. If hunter shows and kill you, you die and timer stops - so you do not loose your booster. If you are not so low on HP and have Mana you can kill the intruder and this is fun. If you are killed you can analyze your log and see what you do wrong, what spells got evaded, resisted etc. You can see how your enemy played, and prepare if he returns. Even you can reskill a little, so next time you are more prepared. I personally get alot adrenaline in such fights no matter if i win or loose.

Most fun in my grind of both chars was to defend Eferias Beach from Ignis. Usually there are hunters, and ignis who like to grind there. After several battles with them usually we grind together or one of teams gives up. Same is for Stone Henge.

Not to mention you have save around and ream and clan mates you can call.

Saltor

05-03-2010, 03:20 PM

Some people play this game for just a few minutes at a time (watching kids and such).
Some prefer to reskill when going from gring to war and back.
Some have so much lag/latency that the WZ is not doable.
Some just hate to be ganked and are willing to grind in a poorer environment to avoid it.

People have been asking for this since I started playing (first day of 1.08) and after grinding two characters to 50, I still don't agree with you.

Nikor

05-03-2010, 04:27 PM

I used to agree to the suggestion unconditionally, but now I think there might be some redesign of the warzone and warzone mob distribution necessary. I'm only speaking for Alsius/Ra here, but at times grinding in the warzone is just about impossible. Orc Camp and the Aggers Market area are almost constantly camped by groups that can reach the size of 10+ player quite easily. And in the area between PP and Aggers you're more likely to end up as roadkill on the Green Hunter Highway than to get any serious grinding done.

Also, grouping up is not always an option, there might just not be enough players to group up with. Lvl 50 players who grind for gold (no shame here, everyone need to repair/buy arrows) might not want to group, so they don't have to share the loot.

Please don't misunderstand me, I don't want any safe grinding spots in the WZ, it's just that at least in Alsius, most good high level grinding spots are unsafe in a way that it's hard to grind there at all.

Alenox_I

05-03-2010, 05:42 PM

BigManOnCampus

05-03-2010, 11:42 PM

I think , more and more the point is being proven.

I entirely disagree. I think as this thread goes along, the issue is just becoming more nuanced than presented in the poll. I've seen at least 4-5 great reasons why the status quo should stay depending on your point of view. I personally think that more incentive to grind in the WZ should be made, however to outright force everyone above lvl 37 to grind in the war zone is a very bad move.

bois

05-04-2010, 01:05 AM

I wonder if it is actually nuanced as you say or if it remains as polarised as ever before.

I do agree that , depending on your perspective there is much evidence and points you can provide to forward your argument. In a much earlier post in this thread I mentioned both sides as I saw it. This thread will definitely be one of those where we will have to agree to disagree.

Of course there is the middle ground. Have alternating levels of mobs placed in the inner and outer realm respectively. Example :
You have (as I suggested earlier) MOBS from level 37 to 42 in both inner realm and the war zone as a transitional form. The mobs outside however , have a better drop, xp and gold rate that its counterparts inside.
After this , you can have alternating levels such as 43,45,47,49,50 in the outer realm and the level 44,46,48,49 ones in the inner realm. No need for any 50 and above in the inner realm in my view. Mind you, I don't agree with this formula.

I did not mention it before but it would be obvious that any distribution of mobs would have to be re arranged with the lower level mobs being close to fort and castle structures so that protection is more readily available. Other pockets occur around saves. The higher you go the higher the risk . I would also mingle some lower level mobs with the ones that level 50 players would grind on as well.

Bottom line is, while I can see the validity of both sides and while I have a bias , this concept could only truly go forward with a compromise on both sides. Added to this , if the current status quo if it has to be superseded, it would have to be replaced with a well thought out and comprehensive solution that seeks to cover the concerns of the widest possible mass of players while still fulfilling the parameters and scope of the game.

With that said , I end my contribution to this thread. Thanks.

Artec.

ncvr

05-04-2010, 06:15 AM

The warzone in horus is a dead, stagnant place. Don't try to keep saying that you still have great bridge wars from time to time. They are nothing compared to what the warzone would be like if people had to stay in it. It looks like that the people who are opposed to this suggestion have absolutely no idea of what the wz was like before NGD fucked up mob placement. Well, there are a few very old Regnum videos on youtube, mainly ones made by the German Guardians and other such clans which show pretty well how good the small skirmishes were back then.

however to outright force everyone above lvl 37 to grind in the war zone is a very bad move.
Why? If you want to RvR you are outright forced to go to the wz, and you will die, get ganked etc. a lot. People better get used to it early. If they did, this forum wouldn't be as much of a bitchfest as it is now.

mute

05-04-2010, 07:29 AM

Well, there are a few very old Regnum videos on youtube, mainly ones made by the German Guardians and other such clans which show pretty well how good the small skirmishes were back then.

Yeah, as a former GG Member I remember the good old times.
Especially when we had a "Grind Zerg" at Alsius beach killing the Aquantis. We always had to be careful, cause the the "Alsius Zerg" could attack us any moment. Sometimes we won the fights and sometimes they send our whole Army back to Central Save.

Yeah, great times.

Punti_X

05-04-2010, 09:07 AM

Godot

05-04-2010, 12:46 PM

haha, red karma for stating my opinion in a poll... now thats childish.
from my cp "05-02-2010 03:09 AM stop trying to win the argument and listen"

I didnt enter an argument; I voted in a poll and stated the reason.
I'm not pretentiously self important enough think my way is the only way;and
my self esteem is sufficient that I dont need to force others into my way of
thinking.

And next time have the guts to sign your red karma instead of letting the time and date do it for you.

Pizdzius

05-04-2010, 03:31 PM

I picked no. Cause I like to lvl my way. I grind for 5 minutes, then rest and draw. When I'm rested, I grind again, then afk and draw. Swinging like that in WZ would end up in dozens of deaths, just because I don't like to pay attention to the game all the time while mindlessly griding.
When I like to grind in WZ and have fun with friends as well, then I go to WZ, only when not alone. That's my choice and I like to have a choice.

MalaTempora

05-04-2010, 03:40 PM

[a bit long, but is a piece of history, and maybe a lesson to learn]

long long time ago, when Ultima Online was the most mmorpg played games, newbie players were killed out of town (out of the secure zones) by others players (called player killers, or PK ) and usually this is a hard price to learn how to survive the PKing, and the learning curve was hard and suffering (in UOL there were FULL looting systems, so when you die you lose all your gears... and
you as ghost see your killers that loot all your possessions.. this is a "sad" situation that almost anyone that have play in UOL know.. :D)
Pker was considered the ruin of the game by many.... many cry to Origins (the game mantainers and creators) asking for a solution to the infamous Pkers, that "normal" players hate...

UOL at first (the first year and half) tell that being a Pkers have a price to pay
(TRUE TRUE imvho) and when a Pker was killed he lost PERMANENTLY a x%
of their skills (the most feared when killed lost almost half their skills) also
the killer can cut his head and go to sheriffs (NPC) to retire the "price"
(some pkers have a very high reward on their head, like the most wanted
in far west :D)
BUT players whine and whine about pkers, and finally Origin satisfy their
wishes: They create a parallel world (TRAMMEL) and you can travel
there by a moonstone, the old world take the name of FELUCCA,and the
big difference by the 2 was that in TRAMMEL player killing was NOT
allowed.. all the Normal move to TRAMMEL, felucca survive with a very
little populations... at the end the game lost all the attraction for
both kind of players.. cause Normal have less challenge, and pkers have
none to fight..

Playing in Regnum have some big similarity:
Grinders = can be similar to Normal player in UOL,
Pkers = hunters and hunting parties

imvho both side need the others to have fun, grinding in wz can be really
fun cause you CAN (CAN and not MUST) be attacked by enemies and
have a fight, where you break your rythm and monotony (sorry dont know
if is the right word, if hard to understand think of boring time)
but true: being attacked by unreachable enemies can be boring too, so
hunters need a bit of reduction OR in fleeing speed (some1 is a real
boring players... atking, and if something goes wrong spamming sotw and
run all the time.. :-D) OR in PET powers to reduce fast ganking effect..

but for the rest, move all the big mobs in wz, and let the grinders swet
on them, this will raise the risk TRUE but after the probable first moment
of blood bathin' people just learn to stay on party or to ask friendly hunters
to help.. and this will move to big cooperation in realm side.

so thumb up on moving them on wz..

(sorry if i go too far with memories)

Hocus

05-04-2010, 03:43 PM

Why not simply make level 50 characters get no exp, no gold, no drops from mobs inside the realm?

This way players can still choose a good place to grind till they reach the maximun level.

Level 50 players grinding inside the realm are nothing but annoying. They don't help in WZ and increase the concurrency for mobs, making non level 50 players make progress even more slowly.

ieti

05-04-2010, 04:44 PM

This is maybe perfect solution. I really really like this idea.

Grinders will have peace in inner, drop grinders must grind in war zone. Add to this +WZ for lower players to grind in War Zone. Level 50 know how to defend self better they need no protection.

Lower XP(-10-15% XP) in inner after 40 and place bonus in WZ(+10-15% XP).
Drop grinders(50's) get no gold, loot, drops in inner.

+10000000 Hocus :clapping5365:

Zodar

05-04-2010, 08:10 PM

I've not voted yet, but sorry ieti, I usually agree with you and don't think its a bad idea in principle, but will probably vote no this time, for the following reasons:

If all the grinding spots were camped it would allow a higher populated realm to severely slow down the levelling speed of a less populated one. Players might only play when their realm is quiet, meaning they may not be able to gather enough friends to clean an area, resulting in no way of gaining XP quickly - grinding is slow enough without this as an additional penalty. Even if one player only kills a grinder a few times in the same place before getting bored, its quite possible that a few minutes later another will come along and do the same; so even though the perception from each is that they've only killed a grinder once or twice, from the grinder's point of view, they've been camped for all the time they've been playing.
Sometimes, admitedly not very often, I can't be bothered with war. It can get boring, particularly when there's a lull in the fighting or people dance at CS. When it does, I want a break and even though grinding can be boring sometimes, when I'm feeling like that, its a convenient way of passing the time while still being on call in case of emergencies and still a slight chance of getting a "reward".
I play the game to relax. Sometimes, I want to switch my brain off and hit a few monsters without paying much attention to what else is going on. I don't want to have to have to worry about going AFK to make a drink, or waste the extra brainpower watching my back, when I.R.L I'm concentrating on a DVD, tidying up, using the telephone, etc. at the same time as playing the game.

As a compromise, I would suggest the following:

Additional incentives for WZ mobs:

a greater challenge bonus
a greater drop chance
A greater number of quests that require you to kill a large (50+) number of mobs from specific WZ areas

The following changes to cities and NPCs:

Move higher level trainers away from higher level grinding spots so players have a long way to travel to retrain
Make all higher level items only accessible from WZ traders

And Player Bonuses / Penalties:

Increased XP for WZ parties
Re-introduce fatigue for inner realm grinders over 40 grinding for more than an hour every 2 hours

BigManOnCampus

05-04-2010, 11:55 PM

Why? If you want to RvR you are outright forced to go to the wz, and you will die, get ganked etc. a lot. People better get used to it early. If they did, this forum wouldn't be as much of a bitchfest as it is now.

I'm wondering if anyone read my post, or the posts of others with very good non-war/non-game-design-reasons for not forcing everyone to do this. Understand that I am not arguing against the principle of encouraging everyone into RvR which is the point of the game. I think if you had read those other posts and thought about it some instead of focusing on your own problem with the game you might understand the reasons.

However, since you do not seem to be the only one who didn't read, I'll lay them out for everyone.

1) Not everyone wants to spend every damn second focusing their full attention on grinding. Grinding in the war zone forces you to do this because any second you could get attacked by a hunter. There are a number of very valuable adult players who grind while doing other tasks (like watching their kids, maintaining their house, etc...) Forcing these people to just accept every random death from rp-whore-hunters is silly and not good for a company's bottom line if they're trying to hold the interest of adults with jobs.

2) ...I'm not gonna name any names, but anyone who's been grinding in the wz on horus (especially at "hotspots" like efe beach) knows exactly who the farming hunters are.... and that's why inner realms are so crowded, and that's what ruins the teamwork, and that's inevitably what causes massive zergs of idiots... which causes more grindaholics who never war, and amplifies the zerg effect...

...... [/rant] :rolleyes2:

3) Some people play this game for just a few minutes at a time (watching kids and such).
Some prefer to reskill when going from gring to war and back.
Some have so much lag/latency that the WZ is not doable.
Some just hate to be ganked and are willing to grind in a poorer environment to avoid it.

4) There are other methods of strongly encouraging players to grind in the war zone without forcing them. You guys pushing this option seem completely unwilling to even consider those other options.

---> Understand that while I may not have been in this game from the beginning, I was in Ultima Online from the initial Beta Test so I know exactly what a FFA MMORPG looks like and I have a good appreciation for the fun that can be had in such a situation. I am not trying to prevent you people from improving the fun in RO, I agree that more war zone population should be encouraged (particularly on Horus). I Do not agree with forcing everyone to play as you want them to play.

e30G

05-05-2010, 01:52 AM

As a compromise, I would suggest the following:

Additional incentives for WZ mobs:

a greater challenge bonus
a greater drop chance
A greater number of quests that require you to kill a large (50+) number of mobs from specific WZ areas

The following changes to cities and NPCs:

Move higher level trainers away from higher level grinding spots so players have a long way to travel to retrain
Make all higher level items only accessible from WZ traders

And Player Bonuses / Penalties:

Increased XP for WZ parties
Re-introduce fatigue for inner realm grinders over 40 grinding for more than an hour every 2 hours

It's a good compromise. I specially like the introduction of fatigue in the inner realm again.

Of course the simplest option is to lower the high level mob concentrations in the inner realm and introduce high yield grind areas in the warzone. This would still allow players to grind in the inner realm during off-peak periods but will not be enough to support full-on grind parties during peak hours. If you can make big parties then the warzone should be the place for you to grind.

Saltor

05-05-2010, 02:20 AM

Brilliant! Then NGD can sell "Anti-PK" scrolls, allowing people to grind without having to deal with the WZ freaks. Pop the scroll and you can't hit or be hit by players.

Seriously, I have no idea why some of you want to FORCE people to play your way (i.e. out in the WZ).

If players want to be in the WZ, they'll get there. If a player DOESN'T want to be out there, trying to force them will just eliminate them from the game. What advantage do you see to making people go out there? Wanting a target rich environment and a dimishing player base is the only probable outcome I can see if y'all get your way.

Think of ways NGD can increase interest in the WZ when they look at redesigning it, don't ask them to cripple Inner Realm grinders.

Mbwana

05-05-2010, 02:35 AM

ncvr

05-05-2010, 05:53 AM

trying to force them will just eliminate them from the game.
Good. Then the server doesn't have to deal with the useless people who spend all their time grinding.

1) Not everyone wants to spend every damn second focusing their full attention on grinding. Grinding in the war zone forces you to do this because any second you could get attacked by a hunter.
Have you been reading the arguments being put forth in favour of this suggestion? If people don't want to die in the war zone and relax while grinding, then their realm mates or clan mates protect them. If your clan mates don't protect you, they're a shitty clan and you should join another one. If you have timezone issues, hang out with a clan which plays in your timezone.

Twinkle1

05-05-2010, 07:54 AM

If all the high lvl mobs are moved to the warzone then all of the lower lvl mobs should be taken out Simplezzzzz

Saltor

05-05-2010, 08:25 AM

Good. Then the server doesn't have to deal with the useless people who spend all their time grinding.

1) You ARE aware NGD is a business, right? The more players they have (to a point), the more money they're likely to make.

2) Useless people? People grind to get to useful levels, to make repair money, to get better gear. That's not "useless", that's common sense.

2a) In regards to better gear: If you DON'T make a habit of helping kill your realm's dragon and WZ boss, you're actually hurting your realm. Getting those drops to players and out into the WZ is important. I'm always disgusted to see someone complaining about people wanting to kill Alasthor when they themselves are wearing Alasthor or Thorkul gear. We're do they think it came from, Santa Claus?

Do you want to have an invasion force of 100 level 30s in crap gear, or do you want 80 level 50s in great gear?

Please people, think beyond "You won't help me take a fort right this minute, you suck!" and consider the other factors involved.

ncvr

05-05-2010, 08:46 AM

"All" is the key word here. Grinding to gain levels doesn't count, but if the only thing you do is grind for drops, then I don't care whether they quit or stay. Grinding for the bare minimum, i.e repair money and levels, is enough. Note: Alasthor and Thorkul do not count as grinding, they count as boss kills. Actually, no, Alasthor counts as glitching. The other dragons count as boss kills.

And also, if you have 80 level 50s in great gear but have no idea how to play, then what are you going to do with them? Try to normal hit everyone to death because that's the only thing they understand after grinding? And lastly, where do you think we got the idea to put high lvl mobs in wz? That's right, because it's how it used to be. General player quality was definitely higher back when this is how it was, because people would have to learn to fight. And there were definitely more high lvls, why? Because people learned to form parties and grind faster that way. Parties are good for faster grinding as well as protection.
I'm always disgusted to see someone complaining about people wanting to kill Alasthor when they themselves are wearing Alasthor or Thorkul gear.
If you're referring to me, I have one piece of alasthor gear which a friend gave me. If you're referring to people in general, that's most certainly not the full story. If our gates are in danger and Ignis is about to break them down, then of course everyone is going to be pissed off at people trying to kill alasthor. Likewise if a fort is taken.

You ARE aware NGD is a business, right? The more players they have (to a point), the more money they're likely to make.
The more people who piss off people who come here to RvR they have, the less money they'll make. What do you think a new player will think when he goes to a fort, eager to take it, then the only response he gets on realm chat is "Fuck you, I'm trying to get an epic sword with 3 +24 weapon bonuses so I can get a full set of epics to grind more effectively with"?

ieti

05-05-2010, 08:52 AM

Regnum is war game and because of this war and teamwork have to be priority. Putting priority of grinding into inner, skipping battles because of camping bossmobs and other common stuff have to be reduced to minimum. This hurts realms alot and do not lead to nothing good.

I can tell you what is the difference between early Horus and today.

Early Horus:
- there was high spawn places in WZ and everyone grinded there.
- WZ was more active.
- people was more coordinated and willing to help.
- fort fights have priority over bossmobs.
- items was gived or exchanged between players.
- knowledge was shared freely.
- less afkers, dancers etc.

Today Horus:
- less and less ppl grind in WZ.
- nearly dead WZ most of time.
- zerg zerg zerg. no coordination. no support between classes. no teamplay.
- people mass switch minutes before bossmobs spawn. they even have web page to know exact time of spawn. after bosskill - mass logoff. noyone waits all to come for kill. they start when they decide there are enought people.
- items are traded or exchanged. sometimes at unhuman prices.
- less people share tricks.
- massive afking force at cs. many people show only if stone is attacked. they do not bother to come to fight at other fort. they do not even bother to help if peoples are killed right next to them at cs.

I can say more people leave game not because of endless grinding, but because of boring, unhealthy atmosphere. If we have spirit to make fights, if we fight good and have fun lower levels will see that and will be glad to level faster and join us. Most of times when someone come to CS it says i'm bored i want to fight but noyone wants to join me...noyone want to wait me to join vesper, noyone want to help me to kill that hunter, noyone want to tell me how to build my setup etc. etc. etc.

Do you like today's situation? I really really hate it! We have no teamwork, we have no friendship we have no war spirit! All i see is afkers, bossmob whoring, zerging...here i do not talk only for syrtis this situation is same in every realm and maybe every server.

Change have to be made that will return the old regnum spirit that we lost lately. Even if this will be hard or unpleasant for some people change have to be made. I do not want to say do what i think - any change that will lead to better motivation, teamspirit, cooperation, fun will be greatly welcome.

e30G

05-05-2010, 08:55 AM

What you (Necrovarus) and Saltor are bringing up are extremes on both ends.

I belong to the camp that wants high level mobs to be WZ only as it was in the past because I experienced how good the warzone was in the past, and how boring it got since NGD changed it.

Maybe we don't need to remove all high level mobs, but at the very least, make it infinitely more attractive to grind in the warzone after level 40. Reduce mob spawn rate in the inner realm so that players can grind there during off peak but make the spawn rate low enough that it couldn't sustain more than 1 party grinding in the area.

IMO, if grind spots were more restrictive in the inner realm, then we would see bigger parties in the warzone. As an added bonus, lower the 10% contribution requirement to maybe 1-2% in the warzone in order to allow big party grinding again. These large parties will easily fend off the hunters that you fear so much.

Inkster

05-05-2010, 09:03 AM

Why not simply make level 50 characters get no exp, no gold, no drops from mobs inside the realm?

Not that i attend it, but what about the lvl 50 characters who go to kill the dragon.

For this reason alone i dont agree on this point

Hocus

05-05-2010, 09:55 AM

Not that i attend it, but what about the lvl 50 characters who go to kill the dragon.

For this reason alone i dont agree on this point

Of course I mean only normal mobs.

Boss mobs stay as they are now.

MalaTempora

05-05-2010, 11:39 AM

if really high lvl mobs cant be moved all to wz, a bunch of solutions (imvho) that can help refill the wz with (any kind of) players:

1- NO Mob leaders insight the wall
2- lower (really drastically) the respawn time of high lvl mobs insight and do
it that a continuos kill of them will lower much more the respawn time of them
(to push players outside, of course)
3- high aggro of mobs insight (so they'll amass fighting to death in group..
giving (or try to give) hard time to spawn-camper)

for the wz:
1- RAISE the drop chance (or at least HIGH Challenge bonus in wz ... taking
account of enemy hunters in YOUR warzone as bonus-raiser, so if hunters
raid your warzone you'll have a little bonus grinding there..)
2- Put leaders of mob various type only in wz and (hope) raise to them the
chance of dropping good gears.. (this can help ppl parties and go to hunt
down leaders in the "quest for the good gears path")
3- Modify the bridge situations (maybe with a simple watchtower for
each side) with a guard and bowman guard, so maybe bridge can do a little
help spot in the fight of grinder versus hunters
4- Punish those hunters (mothaf...ers :D) that kill continuosly the same
grinder... maybe give them a time countdown that start when they kill the
sameone for the second time... and if they kill again those one in a given
time (10min? 15min? NGD choose :D) they lose 20rp (they are all rp whore
so hitting in their only unique interest give them a bad feeling and probably
will make them learn the lesson) if not ATTACKED by him in anyway (that event will break the countdown..)

just my 2 cents.. but definitely to raise the fun SOMETHING MUST BE
DONE IN WZ.. restyle, redone, rework, but please DO SOMETHING...
even a bad bunch of ideas can be better than a slow descent to a secure
death... at least we can say that we have try :D

Cya all,
and have fun

(To hunter RP whore just a little NOTASKED suggestion: BE KIND with ppl you kill,
if possible try to play fair and if (IF) possible when you feel defeated
let them have their blood part... death in this game count little or nothing
and givin' poor grinders a little satisfaction can totally remove the
frustration that you can instill them killin' repeatedly..)

Froste

05-05-2010, 02:36 PM

1- NO Mob leaders insight the wall

Totally forgot about that. Mob leaders are fail, get rid of all of them. They take far longer to kill for less rewards, and there's way too many of them.

If mob factions actually worked they could prove to be an interesting addition, but mob factions is most likely a dead fantasy by now.

BigManOnCampus

05-05-2010, 04:16 PM

Good. Have you been reading the arguments being put forth in favour of this suggestion? If people don't want to die in the war zone and relax while grinding, then their realm mates or clan mates protect them. If your clan mates don't protect you, they're a shitty clan and you should join another one. If you have timezone issues, hang out with a clan which plays in your timezone.

You are STILL trying to tell other people how to play. I'll say this one last time and maybe you'll get it. I DO NOT AGREE with FORCING everyone else to play a certain way. You shouldn't either but all you're allowing yourself to see is your ideal of how everyone in this game should be. Do you understand the difference between ideal and reality? Yes, ideally most everyone would grind in the war zone and battles would be bigger. The reality is people have complex and nuanced behaviors that contribute to the game as-is and no business in their right mind would forcefully turn away customers because of such petty things.

Stop giving reasons people should either play-as-you-say or quit and maybe you'll form an opinion woth reading on this subject.

Mr_Egg

05-05-2010, 04:29 PM

...These players including the level 49 and 50 players who have absolutely no reason to grind inside are there taking absolutely no part in the realm affairs and to be honest they cannot be bothered.
So, we have a few adventurous ones willing to take risks and become frustrated when they get ganked over and over. Thing is, if the others were outside , would players get taken out so often?
Meleketi beach is a fine example. Sometime 5-6 even more players are there while the swamps, Shaanarid and the Orc Camp area are practically deserted . If those 5-6 were outside would hunters have a good chance? They might be able to pick one but success would be mainly thwarted.

I think people need to look beyond the system babysitting them. I honestly believe that if this continues then this server and the quality of its battles will continue to deteriorate. People are generally adverse to change and a movement out of their comfort zone. The reactions are merely a knee jerk reaction to this.
+1
I don't know where Meleketi beach is, never having played in ignis, but I'll assume it's the same sort of grinding spot as Elther beach in Syrtis - mobs 45+ or so, not many of them, completely rammed with players most of the time. And if half the grinders there formed one party, instead of dancing up and down the beach completely ignoring each other, they'd be bigger than most hunting parties, and would be pretty safe in the bigger, quieter grind spots outside... but there's no motivation, because aside from the little GRP bonus they could get, they're actually getting just as much experience and the same drop rate inside the wall.

And the popular warzone spots? Actually, in my experience, players from Syrtis grind in the swamp more than players from Ignis. I myself did the vast majority of 43-46 there on my warlock (with a stolen zarkit :clapclap:), and only ever got caught out once (Kasumi, I think, being the one that found me). A few friends have done the same thing, in other grind spots between the two enemy realms as well, one friend in particular took a grind party to an ignis grinding spot, and ran into an alsius grind party there.... but I'm going off on tangents now. :cuac:

There's a bunch of other posts that I'd quote here and post "+1" next to, but there's no need. Since people are posting compromises, here's my suggestion, based on stuff that I've read here, and other thoughts that popped into my head while scrolling down.

Place a 10% bonus on experience, 10% bonus on gold, and a 50% bonus on drop rate in the warzone. The experience bonus can go down as +WZ, next to the +CHG, +GRP, etc, so that people can see clearly that they are getting another bonus.
(50% bonus drop chance might seem like a lot, but with the current drop rate as low as it is it's only 3-4 more drops every few hours at most, right?)
Directly stolen from Zodar, but add more quests requiring a large number of mobs in wz areas to be killed
Double the +WZ exp bonus to 20% if grinding in an enemy realm - surely people should be rewarded for taking the risk? ;) This might also help teach hunters how to defend their own realm properly, and so become more useful team players.
Double GRP bonus. If there are so few parties and therefore very little teamwork around, then give a greater incentive to work as part of a team.

I think that's a pretty reasonable compromise. It means that there's now real motivation for grinding in a party in the warzone, which would increase teamwork, cooperation, skill levels, overall fun... but those who want to sit in inner realm and have a quiet grind can still do so.

Saltor

05-05-2010, 06:05 PM

There's a bunch of other posts that I'd quote here and post "+1" next to, but there's no need. Since people are posting compromises, here's my suggestion, based on stuff that I've read here, and other thoughts that popped into my head while scrolling down.

Place a 10% bonus on experience, 10% bonus on gold, and a 50% bonus on drop rate in the warzone. The experience bonus can go down as +WZ, next to the +CHG, +GRP, etc, so that people can see clearly that they are getting another bonus.
(50% bonus drop chance might seem like a lot, but with the current drop rate as low as it is it's only 3-4 more drops every few hours at most, right?)
Directly stolen from Zodar, but add more quests requiring a large number of mobs in wz areas to be killed
Double the +WZ exp bonus to 20% if grinding in an enemy realm - surely people should be rewarded for taking the risk? ;) This might also help teach hunters how to defend their own realm properly, and so become more useful team players.
Double GRP bonus. If there are so few parties and therefore very little teamwork around, then give a greater incentive to work as part of a team.

I think that's a pretty reasonable compromise. It means that there's now real motivation for grinding in a party in the warzone, which would increase teamwork, cooperation, skill levels, overall fun... but those who want to sit in inner realm and have a quiet grind can still do so.

This is exactly what I mean by make the WZ more attractive. Thank you Mr Egg. :D

ncvr

05-06-2010, 06:04 AM

You are STILL trying to tell other people how to play. I'll say this one last time and maybe you'll get it. I DO NOT AGREE with FORCING everyone else to play a certain way.
Okay. Actually, it's not forcing them to play a certain way. It's forcing them to do something for their realm, which is what this game is all about. In fact, if you read the home page, it says "All that is required is that you fight for your realm". At its core, this is an RvR game, with a ridiculous and unattractive PvE aspect. Certainly there are things which should be changed to reduce the impact hunters make to how fast you grind, but even if this suggestion was implemented without any other changes, the warzone would be much more lively and active. That I can assure you...because I was there when this was the case. Were you?

You shouldn't either but all you're allowing yourself to see is your ideal of how everyone in this game should be. Do you understand the difference between ideal and reality? Yes, ideally most everyone would grind in the war zone and battles would be bigger. The reality is people have complex and nuanced behaviors that contribute to the game as-is and no business in their right mind would forcefully turn away customers because of such petty things.
The reality is that people who do not spend much time warring are not contributing to their realm or this game. For a war game, this greatly reduces the amount of fun others can have. If you want to grind, there are plenty of great PvE games out there which actually have interesting PvE aspects.

I'm going to say it again - this is how the game used to work. There were no mobs above lvl 35 in inner realms. But nobody cared. I did not see one person make a thread saying that they would quit because it was like this. I have, however, seen many people quit because this isn't the case...me, for one.

Stop giving reasons people should either play-as-you-say or quit and maybe you'll form an opinion woth reading on this subject.
And what is this? Why don't you try to argue without diminishing my opinion or insulting me because my opinion is different to yours?

Revolverxxx

05-06-2010, 07:17 AM

Place a 10% bonus on experience, 10% bonus on gold, and a 50% bonus on drop rate in the warzone. The experience bonus can go down as +WZ, next to the +CHG, +GRP, etc, so that people can see clearly that they are getting another bonus.
(50% bonus drop chance might seem like a lot, but with the current drop rate as low as it is it's only 3-4 more drops every few hours at most, right?)
Directly stolen from Zodar, but add more quests requiring a large number of mobs in wz areas to be killed
Double the +WZ exp bonus to 20% if grinding in an enemy realm - surely people should be rewarded for taking the risk? ;) This might also help teach hunters how to defend their own realm properly, and so become more useful team players.
Double GRP bonus. If there are so few parties and therefore very little teamwork around, then give a greater incentive to work as part of a team.

This is exactly what i was trying to get at too. Give players the option to grind inner or in the warzone but make the advantages of being in the warzone heavily outweigh it. the drop-chance boost is really needed too :clapclap:...

Arafails

05-06-2010, 08:38 AM

What about a population based spawn rate, calculated every 15/30 minutes or so?
So that the more people there are logged in in a realm, the less mobs spawn inside the wall and the more they spawn outside?

Mikan

05-06-2010, 09:00 AM

After some careful reconsideration I have settled on the following proposal for a solution:

1) Keep inner realm mobs just as they are, but make all realms balanced in the levels and distribution of mobs

2) In the warzone for your own realm:
- Give a 15% RLM experience bonus
- Give a 30% gold bonus
- Increase the drop rate by 50%, as suggested earlier

3) In the warzone for enemy realms:
- Give a 25% RLM experience bonus
- Give a 50% gold bonus
- Increase the drop rate by 100%

4) Make each realm's warzone drop special items:
- Alsius drops have a high chance of having Ice and Blunt damage or resistance, with attack speed
- Ignis drops have a high chance of having Fire and Pierce damage or resistance, with cast speed
- Syrtis drops have a high chance of having Lightning and Slashing damage or resistance, with evasion

5) Add gold, magnanite, and ximerin mines to each realm to draw people to war:
- Each gold mine held would give the realm a 10% gold bonus (30% max)
- Each magnanite mine held would give a 5% chance of gaining 1 magnanite from each monster killed (15% max)
- Each ximerin mine held would convert 1% of all gold earned to ximerin (3% max)

Enemy mines could be captured and defended just as if they were forts.

6) MOVE ALL BOSSES FROM ALL REALMS INTO THE WARZONE, AND MAKE THEIR ITEMS USEABLE BY ANYONE

Kind regards.

Minorian

05-06-2010, 10:20 PM

After some careful reconsideration I have settled on the following proposal for a solution:

1) Keep inner realm mobs just as they are, but make all realms balanced in the levels and distribution of mobs

2) In the warzone for your own realm:
- Give a 15% RLM experience bonus
- Give a 30% gold bonus
- Increase the drop rate by 50%, as suggested earlier

3) In the warzone for enemy realms:
- Give a 25% RLM experience bonus
- Give a 50% gold bonus
- Increase the drop rate by 100%

4) Make each realm's warzone drop special items:
- Alsius drops have a high chance of having Ice and Blunt damage or resistance, with attack speed
- Ignis drops have a high chance of having Fire and Pierce damage or resistance, with cast speed
- Syrtis drops have a high chance of having Lightning and Slashing damage or resistance, with evasion

5) Add gold, magnanite, and ximerin mines to each realm to draw people to war:
- Each gold mine held would give the realm a 10% gold bonus (30% max)
- Each magnanite mine held would give a 5% chance of gaining 1 magnanite from each monster killed (15% max)
- Each ximerin mine held would convert 1% of all gold earned to ximerin (3% max)

Enemy mines could be captured and defended just as if they were forts.

6) MOVE ALL BOSSES FROM ALL REALMS INTO THE WARZONE, AND MAKE THEIR ITEMS USEABLE BY ANYONE

Kind regards.

I agree on everything (especially the mine idea, but not the xim one as ngd would lose money, i dunno about everyone else but my buying days would be over ;))

I DO NOT agree with moving all bosses to the wz. Why do ya want this? so your syrtis zerg can drop more epic boss weps? Its quite odd when we kill daen, let us at least kill one of our fuckin bosses.

Mikan

05-06-2010, 10:51 PM

I agree on everything (especially the mine idea, but not the xim one as ngd would lose money, i dunno about everyone else but my buying days would be over ;))
I seriously doubt NGD would lose much money considering that even if a person grind for an entire day and made 300,000 gold, and all three ximerin mines were being held by your realm, that player would only get 3,000 ximerin, which is barely equivalent to $3.50 USD.

And this would be a very rare situation considering the mines could be recaptured by enemy realms.

If anything, they would gain more money, because new players would get many more chances to try out premium, drawing larger numbers of players to buy it after they get a small taste of it but don't want to grind for a thousand years to get enough for anything useful.

I DO NOT agree with moving all bosses to the wz. Why do ya want this? so your syrtis zerg can drop more epic boss weps? Its quite odd when we kill daen, let us at least kill one of our fuckin bosses.
Because of balance (http://www.regnumonline.com.ar/forum/showthread.php?t=59914). Also, I don't only play in Syrtis love. :smile:

Kind regards.

Minorian

05-07-2010, 12:15 AM

Because of balance (http://www.regnumonline.com.ar/forum/showthread.php?t=59914). Also, I don't only play in Syrtis love. :smile:

Kind regards.

Or you could just give all bosses (except wz ones) the same drops, which I would much prefer, because I can just imagine every Syrtis having all the best boss drops within the first month of that implementation :(

Revolverxxx

05-07-2010, 06:50 AM

After some careful reconsideration I have settled on the following proposal for a solution:

1) Keep inner realm mobs just as they are, but make all realms balanced in the levels and distribution of mobs

i agree. removing something is the wrong way to go, instead improving on the warzone would make both parties happy +1 fort this

2) In the warzone for your own realm:
- Give a 15% RLM experience bonus
- Give a 30% gold bonus
- Increase the drop rate by 50%, as suggested earlier

restated what was previously posted by Mr Egg but neverless i like it so +1 for this too

3) In the warzone for enemy realms:
- Give a 25% RLM experience bonus
- Give a 50% gold bonus
- Increase the drop rate by 100%

i like this too, we definately need a greater reward for being at a greater risk

4) Make each realm's warzone drop special items:
- Alsius drops have a high chance of having Ice and Blunt damage or resistance, with attack speed
- Ignis drops have a high chance of having Fire and Pierce damage or resistance, with cast speed
- Syrtis drops have a high chance of having Lightning and Slashing damage or resistance, with evasion

i like the first part but im not so sure about the attack speed/ cast speed/ evasion section. this would result in everyone fighting to grind in ignius while nobody really in grinding in syrtis etc. maybe split this section to around a certain radius around forts or castle ie, around efe castle has a greater chance of dropping cast speed and attack speed around herb etc. Of coarse grinding in a different realm would yield a better chance of getting the drop as stated in your third point so a player from alsius would have a choice of shaana or efe if he wanted a +100% drop rate for a cast speed item but still be capable of dropping it in his own realm if he wasnt able to find a party etc.

5) Add gold, magnanite, and ximerin mines to each realm to draw people to war:
- Each gold mine held would give the realm a 10% gold bonus (30% max)
- Each magnanite mine held would give a 5% chance of gaining 1 magnanite from each monster killed (15% max)
- Each ximerin mine held would convert 1% of all gold earned to ximerin (3% max)

Enemy mines could be captured and defended just as if they were forts.

i always liked the idea of mines. not so sure how the xim one would work but if i was to do the maths (which i dont really want to do at this time) i might have a clearer idea. but +1 to mag and gold mines.

6) MOVE ALL BOSSES FROM ALL REALMS INTO THE WARZONE, AND MAKE THEIR ITEMS USEABLE BY ANYONE

DEFINATELY +1.

Kind regards.

i think there should be a boss mob in the warzone that dropped lvl24 quest rings too ie deadly sights ring/ blacksmith ring etc. this would encourage enemies to occupy enemy realms. For example syrtis wouldnt be interested in a boss that drops DS rings but the other realms would be, could make up for some epic wars (i just sucked that idea out my thumb as i was typing this)

all in all i like your suggestions. forts definately need to be made for attractive and rewards for holding them for fixed periods of time need to be applied and not just for capturing it when upgraded. the mines idea was really good and could somehow be tied into fort capturing.

animalartist

05-18-2010, 11:55 PM

Great move them to wz - but please make some real penalty for save camping?

Its getting beyond a joke.
Cant even cast 1 defensive spell before ambush/confuse and trolled to death. :rale:

(p.s you know who you are - i like the way you run away like a coward when i switch to higher lvl char)

Truewar

05-19-2010, 04:50 AM

Shwish

05-19-2010, 06:07 AM

War Zone is slent not because players grind everytime. If u want fight go and fight. And anyway WHO ARE YOU to say somebody what to do? If someone wants to grind in peace (or even in lonliness) for an hour after work THAT IS HIS DESIRE and THAT IS HIS RIGHT.

If u want active WZ make it so!

some of the suggestions took this into consideration and opted to keep the inner realm mobs the same, but on the other end drasticly improve the grinding in the warzone. I practically live in the warzone because i find that grinding inside the walls to be worse. Either you fight gankers/hunters while grinding in the warzone, or you fight your fellow realm mates for kills on the inner beach. At least in the warzone you might have a small opening to fight back if the ambush/stunfist is resisted.

i would like to see that +WZ percentage implemented in the warzone with a higher drop rate too. Maybe to encourage players to defending and re-taking thier forts, the +WZ percentage decreases with every fort an enemy holds and completely gone when the gates are in danger. for example if the +WZ percent is set to +30%, when aggersborg or trelle is taking it drops by say 7% or 15% when both is occupied by enemies. If Imperial Castle is taken it drops by 15%. When the gates are in danger it drops to +0% and maybe a negative amount when the gates are broken.

Windrium

05-19-2010, 09:21 PM

Actually, that last point... let's modify it a bit. I'm an Alsian, right? So, I'll use Alsius as an example. You ahve all 3 of your forts? +15% xp bonus for grinding in your wz. Lose one? +10%. Lose 2? +5%. No forts/castle? +0% (better be defending your gate).

Grind in syrtis/ignis? +20%! Yay! Capture one of their forts? +25%, 2? +30%, capture both forts and the castle? +35%.

Sounds like a lot, but you'll rarely have all 3 of theirs and have time to grind. :D

But, that way it encourages you to capture your forts, hold them, and to go into enemy territory. The XP bonuses get big, so it encourages people to come into the WZ in a huge way.

Adjust gold/mag accordingly, include mines, please. :D

caye01

05-20-2010, 01:06 AM

after some careful reconsideration i have settled on the following proposal for a solution:

1) keep inner realm mobs just as they are, but make all realms balanced in the levels and distribution of mobs

2) in the warzone for your own realm:
- give a 15% rlm experience bonus
- give a 30% gold bonus
- increase the drop rate by 50%, as suggested earlier

3) in the warzone for enemy realms:
- give a 25% rlm experience bonus
- give a 50% gold bonus
- increase the drop rate by 100%

4) make each realm's warzone drop special items:
- alsius drops have a high chance of having ice and blunt damage or resistance, with attack speed
- ignis drops have a high chance of having fire and pierce damage or resistance, with cast speed
- syrtis drops have a high chance of having lightning and slashing damage or resistance, with evasion

5) add gold, magnanite, and ximerin mines to each realm to draw people to war:
- each gold mine held would give the realm a 10% gold bonus (30% max)
- each magnanite mine held would give a 5% chance of gaining 1 magnanite from each monster killed (15% max)
- each ximerin mine held would convert 1% of all gold earned to ximerin (3% max)

enemy mines could be captured and defended just as if they were forts.

6) move all bosses from all realms into the warzone, and make their items useable by anyone

kind regards.

perfect!...;)

MrSultan

05-20-2010, 01:39 PM

MOBs to the WZ is not really smart,

Some players have a big difference between war and grind,
before they are even reskilled the war is probably(idk how to spell) over.

Minorian

05-20-2010, 01:46 PM

If I am correct the idea behind high lvls grinding in the wz is that theyll be near the war and can come to the fort quickly?

But, if I show up on my warju grind set at a fort, im going to be raged to kingdom come, people really hate warjus (after playing other classes I see why). I personally would just keep grinding, if I want to grind thats what Im going to do.

And we would have to "protect our grinders" unfortunately, no one can catch and kill a hunter, so they would still be able to gank and run. Another thing is most of the time there are more gelfs in Ignis wz then there are Iggs >.> we dont have many on.

Kittypretty

05-24-2010, 11:18 PM

let people grind where they want, so sick of these types of pleas. sure it sounds great for hunters and groups of people wanting easy rp,

but frustrating for those who wish to grind in peace.

not always grind groups available, some dont prefer groups.

and honestly a grind setup and a warzone setup are completely different, at least for me.

Arafails

05-25-2010, 02:41 AM

But, if I show up on my warju grind set at a fort, im going to be raged to kingdom come, people really hate warjus (after playing other classes I see why). I personally would just keep grinding, if I want to grind thats what Im going to do.

Maybe this would help in the deceleration of level 50 SM conjurer proliferation, then. Grind intelligently – you can get a fair whack of XP by wandering around with a couple of warriors and/or archers, and they sure won't say no to the help. That way, you get to (a) help not proliferate "warjurers," and (b) learn more about being a good conjurer.
But no, we can't have that. No, conjurers must grind alone with a setup that sucks for their allies in war it seems, because "Massively Multiplayer" means you have someone to talk to while beating up a computer, for sure.

Quaet

05-25-2010, 09:25 AM

How about removing some experience till you get tnl. Like you said its a war game not a grind game. People have to grind alot till they get to a nice lvl to be totally warzone proof. Personally i think this is a better idea than moving mobs to warzone.

Minorian

05-25-2010, 12:10 PM

Maybe this would help in the deceleration of level 50 SM conjurer proliferation, then. Grind intelligently – you can get a fair whack of XP by wandering around with a couple of warriors and/or archers, and they sure won't say no to the help. That way, you get to (a) help not proliferate "warjurers," and (b) learn more about being a good conjurer.
But no, we can't have that. No, conjurers must grind alone with a setup that sucks for their allies in war it seems, because "Massively Multiplayer" means you have someone to talk to while beating up a computer, for sure.

Unfortunately supporting grinders for xp was slaughtered by NGD in a nerf crusade. If I got better xp from supporting people in a group, believe me, I wouldn't warju grind alone. But, as it is grindjuing is way faster than suporting, so don't expect people to leap at the opportunity to support. I assure you if this was implemented, I wouldn't grind on a support setup, I would stay warju. The only thing that would change would be that, I wouldnt show at fort wars, then you could just be pissed at yourself ;).

And maybe I'm missing a point, but IMO spamming synergy and heals on someone(s) while they slaughter mobs isn't going to help me become a better conju, unless all you want is a conju to spam heal ally and synergy bond in war.

ieti

05-25-2010, 12:47 PM

Mr_Egg

05-25-2010, 08:31 PM

But...but support conju is mostly heal, synergy and dispell. Other side is learning mana management and priorities. So if you support a bigger party you learn some of this. Maybe not in all situations, but still some experience of what you can face in war zone. Even in warju mode you can get some simulation if you try to kill some hard leader mob alone.

I do not think grinding do not get you war experience, but doing this in war zone can lead you to more ideas what you can expect later.

When i grinded my conju to 50 if i get good party around i used zark, SM(was OP) and supported others with regens and mana. Tactics was everyone to make hit or two so we all get XP. Speed with big archer/mage party was pretty good. GRP is good too. Most of times one mage lead and aggroes mobs on him(because he can heal), and others finish them off. Maybe mixed party is good too, but then ranged have to wait for non ranged to land hits, and then kill the mob, so everyone gets XP.

Best party to support is archers/mages. Good XP fast speed. I really do not like to support warriors - constant running around, constant healing and mana. They require alot more attention.

When I was grinding my conjurer up to 50, I used a similar, but in a way, completely different method, and got it done fast and without scrolls.

I setup for a zarkit, and found myself a party, worked out who was attacking first (quite often a barb or knight), set the zarkit to protect them, and cycled party members with buffs, heals and mana as appropriate.

The problem now is that it'd be so hard to find that sort of sized party. When I was grinding my warlock (only 4-5 months after my conjurer), I asked as much as before for a grind party, and very rarely, if ever, found one, and so did most of it alone, which was much, much, much slower. And those times when I did have a party, I made the most of it, because it was so rare. I think between 40 and 50 I only went grinding with about 8-9 different people (all different classes - off the top of my head, Wolfhound Strider, Lussiel Rilme, Drago Raime, Dlort, Nlnlee, Tomislav, Elemere.... a barb whose name I'll probably remember as soon as I post this), as opposed to at least 4-5 times that number with my conjurer (many of whom I still talk to every time I log in now).

And the explanation that makes sense to me is that players are just more self centred than they used to be, and so some incentive to grind outside would be great, because this would force team play, again, to reduce the risk of being hit by hunters.

I'll stop now before I repeat more of what I've already said in earlier posts :cuac:

Quaet

05-26-2010, 07:41 PM

After some careful reconsideration I have settled on the following proposal for a solution:

1) Keep inner realm mobs just as they are, but make all realms balanced in the levels and distribution of mobs

2) In the warzone for your own realm:
- Give a 15% RLM experience bonus
- Give a 30% gold bonus
- Increase the drop rate by 50%, as suggested earlier

3) In the warzone for enemy realms:
- Give a 25% RLM experience bonus
- Give a 50% gold bonus
- Increase the drop rate by 100%

4) Make each realm's warzone drop special items:
- Alsius drops have a high chance of having Ice and Blunt damage or resistance, with attack speed
- Ignis drops have a high chance of having Fire and Pierce damage or resistance, with cast speed
- Syrtis drops have a high chance of having Lightning and Slashing damage or resistance, with evasion

5) Add gold, magnanite, and ximerin mines to each realm to draw people to war:
- Each gold mine held would give the realm a 10% gold bonus (30% max)
- Each magnanite mine held would give a 5% chance of gaining 1 magnanite from each monster killed (15% max)
- Each ximerin mine held would convert 1% of all gold earned to ximerin (3% max)

Enemy mines could be captured and defended just as if they were forts.

6) MOVE ALL BOSSES FROM ALL REALMS INTO THE WARZONE, AND MAKE THEIR ITEMS USEABLE BY ANYONE

Kind regards.

+99999 for you i love this idea :)