New Balance Update: Hits/Criticals/Evasion (Stage 6) - Page 3

TheMessenger · 08-13-2010, 10:32 PM

I tried to test a bit with my marks (server shut down -_-')

but with 5 specialist, 5 RA, 5 Dead Eye(?) I was doing 350 norms. and because dead eye doesnt have a -range and is in the hawks gaze tree it will be very helpful for marks because they can max the tree and get hawkz lvl 4/5 and take out the -speed.

But very nice job NGD, and with just lvl 5 hc passive in aiming mastery or w.e that tree is I had 500+hc (

) so Im pretty happy with marks atm but I still think that every class, but marks especially need a mana boost and spell mana cost reduced and also marks need a bit more range (nothing really seperating hunter and marks range) ppl have suggested making passive range higher and para shorter range and I like that idea.

Wyatt · 08-13-2010, 10:34 PM

Overall nice changes will need to go and do some testing.

Interesting changes done to the map in Alsius Territory.

I suggest you look at this video from PP1 Bridge and how easily players can by-pass the bridge from Alsius side and immediately be on Syrtis side without crossing bridge. That can use some editing too.

Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wZqCKS62jI

Hocus · 08-13-2010, 10:51 PM

Like Enio said, I can't see a DPS increase using Dead eye. I tried it at level 5 and nothing good to my eyes... The feeling is that my medium speed long bow became a slow speed bow.

The skill have a low mana cost but it does not have a good effect. I'm sure I will never put points in this spell. Right now, is just one more spell to spend mana and do nothing but trade attack speed for damage, and a balanced trade, no DPS increase.

Why this name BTW? I don't get it.

Maybe this isn't a good spell. Some users have great ideas of new spells that can fit better than Dead eye.

You could get rid of this new spell and put a spell like "Double target" where the marksman can fire two arrows, each one on a diffent target that is in a close range to the selected enemy. IMO, this fits more with the name of the tree (Aiming) and is much more usable. Just a crazy idea but who knows?! Think about it

Best regards.

TheMessenger · 08-13-2010, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hocus

Like Enio said, I can't see a DPS increase using Dead eye. I tried it at level 5 and nothing good to my eyes... The feeling is that my medium speed long bow became a slow speed bow.

The skill have a low mana cost but it does not have a good effect. I'm sure I will never put points in this spell. Right now, is just one more spell to spend mana and do nothing but trade attack speed for damage, and a balanced trade, no DPS increase.

Why this name BTW? I don't get it.

Maybe this isn't a good spell. Some users have great ideas of new spells that can fit better than Dead eye.

You could get rid of this new spell and put a spell like "Double target" where the marksman can fire two arrows, each one on a diffent target that is in a close range to the selected enemy. IMO, this fits more with the name of the tree (Aiming) and is much more usable. Just a crazy idea but who knows?! Think about it

Best regards.

SS has the same effect as dead eye but less mana and no -attack speed

dead eye should be changed and dmg bonus should be 50% or something

Edit: Also did you change mob health/defense yet? I can't kill mobs w/o them getting to me but I can do that on live

and I see a bit of a change in Crit chance but Evades still need a bit work I think

:/

metsie · 08-13-2010, 11:09 PM

I did some testing with dead eye:

If using fast bow, may be better just to use rapid shot and get higher dps, unless -25%hc in rapid makes lot of evades.

dead eye alone is kind of +-0 30% damage, but also -20% as so either marks needs to use hawks gaze too or just hawks gaze alone to get better dps.

Didn't test with spells yet, but atm mana usage is bit too much to use spell setup only, but maybe buffing this before spells could be nice ( if it affects spell damage)

maybe change that -20%as to -20%hc or lower value of as and this spell could be really nice

evasions are lot better now, haven't seen a single arrow evaded yet vs mobs :P

edit: it does not add spell damage, so not usefull spell like this :/

edit2: and on lower levels it's kind of funny (lvl1 10% damage, -20% as)

edit3: and with old death sentence I made ~50-80 more damage than with this dead eye

NotScias · 08-13-2010, 11:10 PM

I tried a bit with my marks,

Like many others said, the new spell replacing Death Sentence (Dead Eye) is useless, because it gives a small damage bonus (+30%) but this bonus is completely nullified by the Attack Speed malus on this spell (-20%), but this spell still costs mana, so what's the point of spending mana on a spell if you don't get any real benefit at all ?
I tested with a medium 35 bow on ancient lions, I get barely 25 more damage using this spell, but the bow becomes almost like a slow one, so not worth it at all.
I think the Attack Speed malus should be toned down, or the damage increased, to make this spell worth something.

About the chances concerning the Hit Chance and Critical Hit Chance, I think they are good, and it's good to see the Critical Hit Chance % in characters window... Maybe the critical hit chance buffs like point shot are working more, I don't really know I can't conclude anything since it's randomness, but overall the amount of criticals is way lower than before, not because of the new critical hit chance calculation, but because you removed the "more range = more criticals" rule, which was nice in my opinion, because it was giving a benefit for long range marks.
I think this rule should be restored, or at least buff Point Shot because +6% Critical hit chance doesn't really seem to affect anything.

To finish, some thought about the new Hunter spell. I think pets shouldn't benefit of the damage bonus, because that would mean they could get +50% from wrath and +20% from DS dmg bonus, which is a bit excessive...

Miraculix · 08-13-2010, 11:17 PM

What about Spell Focus/Spell Resistance? Are those adjusted the same way the Hit Chance/Evasion system has been adjusted? Will we be able to see them in our character window?

Seher · 08-13-2010, 11:22 PM

125 concentration should give way more crit chance than some %s...
Can't complain about the hit chance, though, it's possible to get some more normals through escapist then.

_Enio_ · 08-13-2010, 11:28 PM

I want to add that from tests new DE, Recharged and DF seem to work quite the same (they seeem to scale only gear damage, no dex etc.)

Tested with DF, DE(5) and Recharged(5) which all add +30% damage. results were very close to eachother.

Losing 20% of your whole DPS for a bonus of 30% for only the gear damage part just cannot work out.

bigjim · 08-13-2010, 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _Enio_

I want to add that from tests new DE, Recharged and DF seem to work quite the same (they seeem to scale only gear damage, no dex etc.)

Tested with DF, DE(5) and Recharged(5).

Losing 20% of your whole DPS for a bonus of 30% for only the gear damage part just cannot work out.

I agree....

The spell is actually making marksmen worse!!

08-13-2010, 10:32 PM	#21
TheMessenger Banned Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 326	I tried to test a bit with my marks (server shut down -_-') but with 5 specialist, 5 RA, 5 Dead Eye(?) I was doing 350 norms. and because dead eye doesnt have a -range and is in the hawks gaze tree it will be very helpful for marks because they can max the tree and get hawkz lvl 4/5 and take out the -speed. But very nice job NGD, and with just lvl 5 hc passive in aiming mastery or w.e that tree is I had 500+hc () so Im pretty happy with marks atm but I still think that every class, but marks especially need a mana boost and spell mana cost reduced and also marks need a bit more range (nothing really seperating hunter and marks range) ppl have suggested making passive range higher and para shorter range and I like that idea.

08-13-2010, 10:51 PM	#23
Hocus Apprentice Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Brasil Posts: 94	Like Enio said, I can't see a DPS increase using Dead eye. I tried it at level 5 and nothing good to my eyes... The feeling is that my medium speed long bow became a slow speed bow. The skill have a low mana cost but it does not have a good effect. I'm sure I will never put points in this spell. Right now, is just one more spell to spend mana and do nothing but trade attack speed for damage, and a balanced trade, no DPS increase. Why this name BTW? I don't get it. Maybe this isn't a good spell. Some users have great ideas of new spells that can fit better than Dead eye. You could get rid of this new spell and put a spell like "Double target" where the marksman can fire two arrows, each one on a diffent target that is in a close range to the selected enemy. IMO, this fits more with the name of the tree (Aiming) and is much more usable. Just a crazy idea but who knows?! Think about it Best regards. __________________ Hocus {Focus, Venator, Veneficus, Surculus} [Ra] Aliança Luso-Brasileira [Ra]

08-13-2010, 11:09 PM	#25
metsie Apprentice Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 59	I did some testing with dead eye: If using fast bow, may be better just to use rapid shot and get higher dps, unless -25%hc in rapid makes lot of evades. dead eye alone is kind of +-0 30% damage, but also -20% as so either marks needs to use hawks gaze too or just hawks gaze alone to get better dps. Didn't test with spells yet, but atm mana usage is bit too much to use spell setup only, but maybe buffing this before spells could be nice ( if it affects spell damage) maybe change that -20%as to -20%hc or lower value of as and this spell could be really nice evasions are lot better now, haven't seen a single arrow evaded yet vs mobs :P edit: it does not add spell damage, so not usefull spell like this :/ edit2: and on lower levels it's kind of funny (lvl1 10% damage, -20% as) edit3: and with old death sentence I made ~50-80 more damage than with this dead eye Last edited by metsie; 08-13-2010 at 11:22 PM.

08-13-2010, 11:10 PM	#26
NotScias Baron Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: /dev/null Posts: 766	I tried a bit with my marks, Like many others said, the new spell replacing Death Sentence (Dead Eye) is useless, because it gives a small damage bonus (+30%) but this bonus is completely nullified by the Attack Speed malus on this spell (-20%), but this spell still costs mana, so what's the point of spending mana on a spell if you don't get any real benefit at all ? I tested with a medium 35 bow on ancient lions, I get barely 25 more damage using this spell, but the bow becomes almost like a slow one, so not worth it at all. I think the Attack Speed malus should be toned down, or the damage increased, to make this spell worth something. About the chances concerning the Hit Chance and Critical Hit Chance, I think they are good, and it's good to see the Critical Hit Chance % in characters window... Maybe the critical hit chance buffs like point shot are working more, I don't really know I can't conclude anything since it's randomness, but overall the amount of criticals is way lower than before, not because of the new critical hit chance calculation, but because you removed the "more range = more criticals" rule, which was nice in my opinion, because it was giving a benefit for long range marks. I think this rule should be restored, or at least buff Point Shot because +6% Critical hit chance doesn't really seem to affect anything. To finish, some thought about the new Hunter spell. I think pets shouldn't benefit of the damage bonus, because that would mean they could get +50% from wrath and +20% from DS dmg bonus, which is a bit excessive... __________________ 天 The other realm awaits... Now playing much better games

08-13-2010, 11:17 PM	#27
Miraculix Count Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Infinite Improbability Drive Posts: 1,287	What about Spell Focus/Spell Resistance? Are those adjusted the same way the Hit Chance/Evasion system has been adjusted? Will we be able to see them in our character window? __________________ Hit me, nail me, make me God. Panoramix :: Half Elf Hunter ## Miraculix :: Half Elf Marksman ## Aspirinix :: Wood Elf Conjurer Syrtis :: Horus :: Antartes

08-13-2010, 10:34 PM	#22
Wyatt Count Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 1,544	Overall nice changes will need to go and do some testing. Interesting changes done to the map in Alsius Territory. I suggest you look at this video from PP1 Bridge and how easily players can by-pass the bridge from Alsius side and immediately be on Syrtis side without crossing bridge. That can use some editing too. Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wZqCKS62jI

08-13-2010, 11:22 PM	#28
Seher Count Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Bavaria Posts: 1,026	125 concentration should give way more crit chance than some %s... Can't complain about the hit chance, though, it's possible to get some more normals through escapist then.

08-13-2010, 11:28 PM	#29
_Enio_ Marquis Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany Posts: 1,843	I want to add that from tests new DE, Recharged and DF seem to work quite the same (they seeem to scale only gear damage, no dex etc.) Tested with DF, DE(5) and Recharged(5) which all add +30% damage. results were very close to eachother. Losing 20% of your whole DPS for a bonus of 30% for only the gear damage part just cannot work out. __________________ Fix the Marksman subclass: Suggestion