Hello, Haven is dying.

[Awrath]

Originally Posted by Cranddor

Now it's official: this Krungle guy is an idiot.

This was official a long time ago, on the 6th of March in fact, the day he joined.

[ieti]

Oh god why...

[Adrian]

I don't agree with a lot of things this user (Krungle) has to say, but please STOP calling people "idiot" because they have a different opinion.

Reply with arguments, leave them "talking alone" or just ignore them.

I'm seeing this a lot, and it's a shame that there a lot of users have only hatred to offer. Most of the users say that the community is the reason they like the game. Well, we can ruin the game -as popular opinion says- but you are ruining the community with this attitude.

I don't say that you have to agree with people like him, I humbly say that someone that insults other people can't be taken seriously. There's a saying that goes "for whatever you do, there will always be someone that hates it and someone who loves it", so, even if we screw it up, for some it will float their boats. This is for everything in life. So, if you want things to be better, start with yourselves too

[GreekFireborn]

Originally Posted by Adrian

I don't agree with a lot of things this user (Krungle) has to say, but please STOP calling people "idiot" because they have a different opinion.

Reply with arguments, leave them "talking alone" or just ignore them.

I'm seeing this a lot, and it's a shame that there a lot of users have only hatred to offer. Most of the users say that the community is the reason they like the game. Well, we can ruin the game -as popular opinion says- but you are ruining the community with this attitude.

I don't say that you have to agree with people like him, I humbly say that someone that insults other people can't be taken seriously. There's a saying that goes "for whatever you do, there will always be someone that hates it and someone who loves it", so, even if we screw it up, for some it will float their boats. This is for everything in life. So, if you want things to be better, start with yourselves too

KRUNGLE=ADRIAN SPREAD THE WORD
on a serious note i tend to hate people and call them names when their iq is negative,thats me

[bois]

This one is veering off topic.

What I will say is this. Haven, despite numerous intervention is no way where it should be in terms of population.
Many, many mistakes were made. The biggest one being that Haven (Horus) never was and will never be the same character as RA.

For economical costs, I understand whey there must be a one size fits all approach. But, Nemon, Tyr, Piranha, Raven suggests otherwise.

Raven may not be dying but it certainly is only treading water at this stage. Growth and activity is nowhere it should be for such a mature server.

Krungle.
Unfortunately the Internet and this forum has its own morality and correction system. Despite my repeated cautions and advice on how to go here, Krungle walked a path that aggravated many users. I admire his courage for riding it out and as his understanding of the game improves his posts improve. Sadly, his initial posture will leave him sustaining collateral damage over time.

Oh and by the way (because I won't let it go easily for the sheer weakness of the act. ) maybe instead of giving me -15 karma points for speaking truth (ego aside) maybe NGD should reply with arguments, leave me "talking alone" or just ignore me.

This punitive approach seem to be happening a lot and it is a shame. Well, we can ruin the game -as popular opinion says- but actions can ruin the community. Look a this forum , it is on life support. Maybe NGD prefers it this way. No negative reviews is good news.

I don't say that you have to agree with people like me, I humbly say that someone that punitively punishes other people because of their own internal weakness can't be taken seriously. There's a saying that goes "Karma ( not the character) is a bitch and she pays back with interest", This is for everything in life. So, if you want things to be better, start with yourselves too

And for goodness sake, man up and sign the negative karma. Hiding anonymously is just weak.

This message brought to you by Bois the raging egomaniac , and the letter M.

[Adrian]

Originally Posted by bois

...

Wow, too much resentment there. Read again your reply, please. We'd like an active English forum. We don't care if it's all about our mistakes, but we do care if it's all about "I'd do it better", "I warned you" or "you're an idiot because I think different".

Haven can't raise the population because of a lot of reasons and we're here to discuss them and those three attitudes I mentioned are ruining that process. Forums are not for determining who's right, but to create options by looking into problems.

[Masterkick]

Having played both Ra and Haven, and knowing there's a big difference in terms of player base, I've been thinking on trying a different approach for Haven.

As of now, Ra is crowded, like really crowded. This has a positive and a negative connotation for the users. People who like going to war and capturing forts, participating in the invasions, are of course delighted of how much of this the server is now offering. The thing is, there are also guys who like hunting all by themselves or with a friend or two. Well, that is almost no longer possible on Ra due to the dense population.

The different approach I mentioned earlier, would be to see Haven not only as the "english speaking" server, but also as a potential second home for Ra players who would like to hunt alone or with one or two companions, or just to take a rest from the endless war.

So how do we put it into action? Maybe a system allowing players from Ra to copy characters to Haven... managed in-game. This would mean, it could cost gold (a considerable sum) to copy a character (you would still be able to play it on Ra) AND ximerin as a short-cut. The copied character on Haven would be just like the character on Ra, but unequipped. Maybe to increase revenue even further the character could be copied with just a 50% of its power and discipline points, which would then be gained by doing some quests on Haven involving the WZ. These quests should not be THAT difficult and would be given by the character-copying NPC.

At first a burst of Ra players would copy their characters to Haven, making it more fun yet not near as crowded as Ra. So it would be more of a hunting server in the beginning... then as action would get better some old players would come back and player retention would improve; it could slowly turn into another Ra, meaning a full-fledged server.

That's my suggestion, though I know it would be really hard to implement.

Regards!

[Krungle]

Originally Posted by Masterkick

The different approach I mentioned earlier, would be to see Haven not only as the "english speaking" server, but also as a potential second home for Ra players who would like to hunt alone or with one or two companions, or just to take a rest from the endless war.

This is an important thing to keep in mind, the common language of a server. Language is used to communicate plans of action, strats, etc. There is already a running complaint with Alsius of the Alsius Split where half the team goes one way and the other half another. Not only would two (or more) languages compound this problem but it would extend it into other realms, realms that are struggling mightily at the moment. I am not against other languages, just that each server needs a base language and stick to it, whatever that language may be.

Originally Posted by Masterkick

Maybe a system allowing players from Ra to copy characters to Haven.The copied character on Haven would be just like the character on Ra, but unequipped.

Or perhaps with a 'transfer packet' of gear? This is an idea that some may like. All I say to it is it doesn't take that long to get a toon to 40 and I got one toon from 52 to WarMaster in less than a week. But this is a revenue stream so it may be something the Devs might like.

Originally Posted by Masterkick

it could slowly turn into another Ra, meaning a full-fledged server.

Really, I like Haven because it is what it is. Some people prefer Ra because it is what it is. Neither camps are wrong, just different, which is fine and as it should be. Population, as I see it, on Haven is fine during Prime Times but the off-hours are a bit slow. I have no clue how to market to time slots, especially off-hour time slots. It is this that I see as the major break down on the population issue.

As far as the Realm War issue is concerned, I think the problems of imbalance there has more to do with team work than anything else. I won't go into detail here much on the subject because I like being on the team with the advantage, as I am sure most would be. But I have seen several times Alsius being vastly outnumbered and still win. I believe the majority of players believe that win = numbers, but this is not the case. If Ignis and Syrtis would spend more time on developing strats rather than complaining about a realm to realm population disparity which does not exist, maybe they could stop relying so much on numbers and alliances and make the game more fun for all of us. I think that alone will bring more of the older players back and retain the newer ones.

In conclusion, we do not need to have a population of Ra to be a 'full-fledged server' but instead all the realms need to learn to work smarter with the numbers we do have to bring about wins. This is why I prefer Haven over Ra and most people who return from Ra agree with me (and there are quite a few). This is not to say that some increase in population is not a good thing, it is, but just to say it is not everything and not as much of an issue as I have seen it portrayed to be.

[ieti]

Dude just stop with "goats are better not because of numbers" already. Just stop... We all know how wrong it is...

I played Syrtis at it's most zergy times and i know how you can think about other realms. It is the same - cmoon stop whining, come and fight, do not give up, we are bored with you, here take this negative wish you allying sc*m...

The only times when skill matter is when numbers are equal. Period! Even then there are other factors like gear, class team composition and so on.

You want me to believe that a fort camped with 15-20 goats 2/3 of which are warriors and others are marks and conjus/locks is a matter of tactics and skill to recap? Bullsh*t!

Only you can do in such case is get enough allies and recap it with pure force. No tactics, no skill nothing...

Anyway...i like wars at EU active times, because difference between realms is not so big. But if we look at time zones which are "abused" from realms to invade i can not say good words. No matter syrtis, alsius or ignis - invading empty realms is noobish.

-- Flame on --

Aside from all this even that goats are dominnat now some players still keep the old "underpop" attitude. They fight only when they can win. If tides turn they give up. I have not seen PP fights for ages - cmon syrtis are bad now give them some love. Main forts fights are rare - well you have numbers and teamwork show them in more challenging environment.

-- Flame off --

[kmdk]

Originally Posted by Adrian

We'd like an active English forum. We don't care if it's all about our mistakes, but we do care if it's all about
"I'd do it better",
"I warned you"

Haven can't raise the population because of a lot of reasons and we're here to discuss them and those three attitudes I mentioned are ruining that process. Forums are not for determining who's right, but to create options by looking into problems.

I know i'm always very harsh in critics ,but you know critics are usual from active players that actually spend lots of time in game.

Even critics means feedback.
Not always good feedback is constructive.Because 40 players can tell you nice feature but others 60 leave the product alone.
In that case i think need to analyze your bad feedbacks.The solution over years did by NGD just ban players that send bad feedbacks,without even analyze them naming "uncostructive threads"
I know you take as reference RA as "success " business.Here i can argue about that you are doing wrong.In my country are over 20 MMO that are complete success here but complete fail in internationally servers,is the same as NGD ,RA success in spanish but lets say not going forward on international.And even i think CoR is a hight quality game.

The only internationally market that NGD succeeded it was Linux native client.It was a big plus for it.The model why a player leaves in first 10 lvl-s the game i don't think is related to that new players don't rush directly to war zone to understand about game.

In my personal opinion is about:

1.)lack of enough infos in first stages (not even a tutorial complete about move,spell bars,etc)

2.)boringness of first levels,nothing to interact with ,just go there and kill 5 mobs ,go there and kill other 10 mobs ...kill mobs kill mobs kill mobs ,after killing 100 mobs in first 5-6 lvls ,CoR doesn't offer in first stages a diversity of activities to "keep player excited to find out whats next".

3.)For old players i think there is a list over years of what they don't like ,i don't need remember them .

I think first stages need other interactive ways ,i have no idea what but maybe there are tons of suggestions and there will be.Or maybe revamp complete of first 30 lvl-s of quests system,build other one.

I don't even think NGD shall threat any negative feedback as offense over NGD.NGD critic heavy the players the give negative feedback and complete ignoring them(because of same EGO that players have).
The problem that i see in this "constructive discussion" is that wee play mouse and cat.Wee say "that is bad" ngd say " do it in constructive way" ,wee suggest and ngd ignoring.

Originally Posted by ieti

I hate goats post #250

To be honest you complaint to much about goats attitude ,yes there are some that say X and y think ,but not generalize thinks.There will be always people that says : "goats are sucks,greens are sucks ,reds are sucks..greens are hackers ,reds are hackers,goats are hackers... etc ...

Originally Posted by ieti

The only times when skill matter is when numbers are equal.

What game you play ? O.o gears = skills And this is other reason that "some" players left game ,gears count too much and not skills.
Luck/cash in atm gameplay = Pro Player .