Current state of the International Proletarian Revolution

terekon · 02-28-2010, 09:23 AM

posting in forums is what i do when im not out changing the world. Or killing elves and goats...

Torg_Snowflake · 02-28-2010, 04:17 PM

Well I disagree. I like Capitalism.

I think it prizes the hard work and efforts of someone who studied a lot, worked a lot, and made a career for himself.

Why would I even make an effort in becoming a scientist if everyone earns the same, has the same, etc? We would all want the easy efortless tasks.

terekon · 02-28-2010, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torg_Snowflake

Well I disagree. I like Capitalism.

I think it prizes the hard work and efforts of someone who studied a lot, worked a lot, and made a career for himself.

Why would I even make an effort in becoming a scientist if everyone earns the same, has the same, etc? We would all want the easy efortless tasks.

I really dont understand this logic. I guess in the "real world" ppl dont get careers because thats what they want to be, everyone lets at the size of the pay check first.

Me personally regardless of pay i would do what makes me happy. If it would make you happy to clean toilets because its the path of least resistance, then we must have much worse problems than the discussion economic policies. Glutton will be the name of the next of the next american generation, since no doubt they will spend their days feeding at the overflowing pig trough of commercialism, and hatred.

Torg_Snowflake · 02-28-2010, 05:07 PM

You would be surprised by the number of people that would choose the toilet cleaning.

I would also want to do something I like tough.

I had debated and talked with many. Some people have valid ways of apllying socialist ideals to democracy. Some think you need a central power to be sure you keep everything "equal" but then you create a power over the human, just another facade for any opressing ruling. Then you have the utopia beliviers that just can't get out of pure theory and will never be able to apply anything to real life. Then again, some are idiots that can't acomplish anything and belive a system that does not prize acomplishment will be better for themselves.

Vythica · 02-28-2010, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torg_Snowflake

Then again, some are idiots that can't acomplish anything and belive a system that does not prize acomplishment will be better for themselves.

Hard work and accomplishment are rewarded in a communist society. The reward is just spread between everyone. But we wouldn't want that would we? Mine, mine, mine, I suppose.

Torg_Snowflake · 02-28-2010, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vythica

Hard work and accomplishment are rewarded in a communist society. The reward is just spread between everyone. But we wouldn't want that would we? Mine, mine, mine, I suppose.

A human beign doesn't get a sense of acomplishment easly. Has to do with motivational factors. I know the "reward" would push society forward, but it need to be somewhat palpable for the individual to make him feel like he progessed.

Keep the sarcastic/ironic bits to yourself.

Vythica · 02-28-2010, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torg_Snowflake

A human being doesn't get a sense of accomplishment easily. Has to do with motivational factors. I know the "reward" would push society forward, but it need to be somewhat palpable for the individual to make him feel like he progressed.

Keep the sarcastic/ironic bits to yourself.

I think that when one no longer has to work 3 jobs 90 hrs a week to feed his family, that the average worker will feel like he's progressed. Not only that, but in a communist society there will be more time for leisure and so man will also get his sense of accomplishment from the art he creates or the songs he sings or the sports that he excels in.

And thank you very much, I'll use whatever modes of linguistic expression available to the English language to convey my point. I will not remove sarcasm nor irony from the arsenal of my tongue.

JennyfromtheBlock · 02-28-2010, 05:35 PM

All human suffering springs from unbridled desire. Unless one extricates oneself from the clutch of greed, one will not free himself from the fetters of sorrow. - Vellupillai Pirapakaran

Godot · 02-28-2010, 05:53 PM

I see it in a more black and white mindset.
Capitalists are highly materialistic and goal oriented on the personal level.
Where a socialistic person is in it for the team win, they dont worry so much
about the 60 inch lcd tv on the wall or the porsche in the garage ,he is
concerned more with food for his elderly neighbor or the kid down the street
with cancer that cant afford chemo.
Yes greed is a motivator; but at what cost?
I gotta look in the mirror everyday, if the guy looking back hurts others
just to get a little more for himself....I dont want to be that guy.

makarios68 · 02-28-2010, 06:05 PM

Swap Capitalism for what exactly?

Various alternatives have been tried and all have failed.

All that happens is one set of bullies gets replaced with another.

The reason for this is simple: most people don't want power, they don't want to rule or to govern. They just want to raise their families in peace.

But there are a minority of people who crave power. And it is these people that we need to be wary of. There has to be a political system in place which ensures that these power-hungry people don't take excess liberties with the power they are given.

In this respect the capitalist system is the best in human history. Our leaders are accountable to us, we can kick them out of office at voting time, they can be brought to trial for wrongdoings - we can even openly mock them in the media.

Don't get me wrong, capitalism is a long way from being perfect - i'm well aware of it's failings.

I'm just saying that is the best political system to date.

As for Marxism - it has a very useful role as a critique of capitalism. It shines the spotlight on the failings of capitalism.

But if you shout for a revoltion - you need to be careful.

You never know what you'll get!

02-28-2010, 09:23 AM	#1
terekon Pledge Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Canada Posts: 25	posting in forums is what i do when im not out changing the world. Or killing elves and goats... __________________ WAR IS PEACE - FREEDOM IS SLAVERY - IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH Terekon\|52 Onuris\|50 Peccavi\|WM\|60 Beaver Cheese\|41 Aletron\|32

02-28-2010, 04:17 PM	#2
Torg_Snowflake Initiate Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Lomas de Zamora Posts: 243	Well I disagree. I like Capitalism. I think it prizes the hard work and efforts of someone who studied a lot, worked a lot, and made a career for himself. Why would I even make an effort in becoming a scientist if everyone earns the same, has the same, etc? We would all want the easy efortless tasks. __________________ Torg Snowflake Brujo Pirómano de Alsius, Vagallero Cornflakes y Consejero de La Jihad

02-28-2010, 05:07 PM	#4
Torg_Snowflake Initiate Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Lomas de Zamora Posts: 243	You would be surprised by the number of people that would choose the toilet cleaning. I would also want to do something I like tough. I had debated and talked with many. Some people have valid ways of apllying socialist ideals to democracy. Some think you need a central power to be sure you keep everything "equal" but then you create a power over the human, just another facade for any opressing ruling. Then you have the utopia beliviers that just can't get out of pure theory and will never be able to apply anything to real life. Then again, some are idiots that can't acomplish anything and belive a system that does not prize acomplishment will be better for themselves. __________________ Torg Snowflake Brujo Pirómano de Alsius, Vagallero Cornflakes y Consejero de La Jihad

02-28-2010, 05:35 PM	#8
JennyfromtheBlock Apprentice Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Canada Posts: 64	All human suffering springs from unbridled desire. Unless one extricates oneself from the clutch of greed, one will not free himself from the fetters of sorrow. - Vellupillai Pirapakaran __________________ Haven\|Ignis\|Apocalypse Jenny from the Block \| Naughty Nymph \| Naughty Vixen \| Camilla \| Atomic Betty \| Dixie Queen It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine. - REM

02-28-2010, 05:53 PM	#9
Godot Apprentice Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 91	I see it in a more black and white mindset. Capitalists are highly materialistic and goal oriented on the personal level. Where a socialistic person is in it for the team win, they dont worry so much about the 60 inch lcd tv on the wall or the porsche in the garage ,he is concerned more with food for his elderly neighbor or the kid down the street with cancer that cant afford chemo. Yes greed is a motivator; but at what cost? I gotta look in the mirror everyday, if the guy looking back hurts others just to get a little more for himself....I dont want to be that guy. __________________ There are 4 things you can never recover: The stone..after the throw. The word..after it's said. The occasion..after it's missed. The time..after it's gone.

02-28-2010, 06:05 PM	#10
makarios68 Count Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: England Posts: 1,300	Swap Capitalism for what exactly? Various alternatives have been tried and all have failed. All that happens is one set of bullies gets replaced with another. The reason for this is simple: most people don't want power, they don't want to rule or to govern. They just want to raise their families in peace. But there are a minority of people who crave power. And it is these people that we need to be wary of. There has to be a political system in place which ensures that these power-hungry people don't take excess liberties with the power they are given. In this respect the capitalist system is the best in human history. Our leaders are accountable to us, we can kick them out of office at voting time, they can be brought to trial for wrongdoings - we can even openly mock them in the media. Don't get me wrong, capitalism is a long way from being perfect - i'm well aware of it's failings. I'm just saying that is the best political system to date. As for Marxism - it has a very useful role as a critique of capitalism. It shines the spotlight on the failings of capitalism. But if you shout for a revoltion - you need to be careful. You never know what you'll get!